From: jouppe
Message: 53481
Date: 2008-02-17
--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "jouppe" <jouppe@...> wrote:
>
> You will find the following Finnish words with reflexes of IE
> laryngeals in the lexicon under the link below. Most of them have
> entered Finnish etymological lexica during the last 20 years or so.
> None of them is invented by me:
>
> kalja
> kaski
> lehti
> teke-
> teho
> tehda-s
> tuoda
> tuuli
> kasa
> kalvas/kalpea
> kokea
> rohto
> kesä
> inhi-m-i-
> myy-dä
> nai-nen
> reht-o
> suoni
> suku
> kulke
> kasvaa
>
> It makes 20+ but the list is not exhaustive. There are some words
> lacking here that were lost in Finnish or that happen to lack
> cognates in English.
>
> Laryngelas were lost in non-Anatolian languages before they started
> to be recorded in writing. Judged from this evidence they seem to
> have been retained for quite long in pre-Balto-Slavic (and pre-
> Germanic??).
>
> I'm not an expert on the accentuation system of Balto-Slavic but I
> reacall having read that the effect of laryngeals on the syllabic
> structure is traceable in the accentuation of some daughter
languages
> (Lithuanian?, Slovenian?) even today.
>
> Jouppe
>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Rick McCallister <gabaroo6958@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Thanks for your explanation. I'm intrigued by how
> > kaski ended up with *k-. My impression was that,
> > except for traces in Greek and Armenian, non-Anatolian
> > IE lost its laryngeals. Yet, I'm guessing Uralic could
> > only have borrowed this word from Germanic,
> > Balto-Slavic, Indo-Iranian or Tokharian. AFAIK, there
> > were no other IE languages in the path of Uralic
> > --unless we count Temematic.
> >
> >
> > --- jouppe <jouppe@> wrote:
> >
> > > In the oldest borrowings in Pre-Finnic it is more a
> > > rule than an
> > > exception that the second syllable is more or less
> > > dropped as the
> > > lexeme is adopted directly as a plain stem.
> > > Parallels would include
> > > onki, pursi, susi, vuori, vuosi and others.
> > >
> > > I have written about this at
> > > http://koti.welho.com/jschalin/substitutions.htm
> > >
> > > substitution of PIE -zg- by Pre-Finnic -sk- is
> > > parallelled by the PU
> > > word *mos´ki- <= PIE *mozg-.
> > >
> > > The substitution by Pre-Finnic /sh/ (I use the
> > > digraph here) is very
> > > common in later, Proto-Baltic and Proto-German
> > > loans.
> > >
> > > The word kaski also has no real competing etymology.
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "fournet.arnaud"
> > > <fournet.arnaud@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > http://koti.welho.com/jschalin/lexicon.htm
> > > > >
> > > > > ashes
> > > > > Fi. kaski 'burnt-over clearing'
> > > > > < PreF *kaski / *kaśki
> > > > >
> > > > > (see) Sw.aska 'ashes' < Gmc. *askōn 'ashes'
> > > > > < ↑ PIE/PreG *ħæsk'-
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > This individual is comparing Finnish kaski to
> > > Gmc
> > > > > *askon
> > > >
> > > > ========================
> > > > Thank you for the link.
> > > > Whatever value it may have,
> > > > it's always interesting to roam thru data.
> > > >
> > > > As far as the *kaski from *askon is concerned,
> > > > Preservation of -s- in Finnish is strange,
> > > > meaning it should be recent (if the idea is true)
> > > > Cf. hanhi out of *zhans-is
> > > > Now the final -i- means Finnish borrowed *kask-,
> > > > with no -on- ending.
> > > >
> > > > I have much difficulty to believe
> > > > this borrowing *askon > *kask-
> > > >
> > > > I have nothing better to propose
> > > > but I don't buy this story.
> > > >
> > > > Arnaud
> > > > ==================
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
______________________________________________________________________
> ______________
> > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
> > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
> http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?
category=shopping
> >
>