Re: [tied] Re: Alb. suffix "-oj"

Piotr Gasiorowski wrote:

> 19-11-03 21:51, alex wrote:
>
>> I find very interesting the fact that Rom. make _the same thing_ with
>> Slavic, Hungarian, etc loans. ( later as latin inherited/loans).
>> For this , to "romanise" the verbs there is the sufix "-ui", ecxactly
>> how Albania does with Latin verby with suffix "-oj"
>> Strange coincidence, isn't it? Strange phoneticall, strange on the
>> time line after all today known linguistic facts.
>
> The only strange thing (apart from the construction of your last
> sentence) is that you make the connection at all. Verbs in <-ui> are
> neither the most productive class in Romanian, nor connected in any
> way with Alb. -o(n)j. In loans from Slavic, such as <a trebui> the
> extension <-ui> is, I suppose (our Romanian experts may clarify this
> further), a substitute for the Slavic formative suffix *-ovati, 1sg.
> *-ujo~.
>
> Etymologically, Albanian presents in <-o(n)j> correspond most closely
> to Romanian verbs in <-a> (or French ones in <-er>, Spanish ones in
> <-ar>, etc). It's enough to compare <judeca> : <gjykoj>, <cânta> :
> <këndoj>, or any modern loans like <fermenta> : <fermentoj> (the
> pattern is still fully productive).
>
> Piotr

What I can constate by myself, the suffix become very productive when
making verbs from nouns.
gât > gâtui(neck-to strangle); mânã > mânui (hand- to handle), etc.
Apparently this suffix is attached to words which end in consonant (
where the old final "u" became mute). In this case the word "mânã"
(hand) must derive from an older *manu with change of the gendre (why?);
here appers this is no speculation of me since the latin word was
"manus".

Rosetti quote here Al. Graur which sustain the sufix "-ui" should derive
from an older nasalised form "-uni" where "n" was assimilated by "i" as
in other "yotacisms" [ ni > i( spune-spui); ri>i ( sãri-sãi); li > i (
cale-cãi)].
That appears a more paralel with Alb. in this case.[ see (-onj) versus
(-uni) ]
There is no reference of any Slavic *-ujo~ as being the basis for this
suffix.

Alex