Re: Slavic "o" ( it was Romanian Loans in OCS?)

My opinion is that <obori> is obviously Slavic loan, but it doesn't
mean that also <dobori>, <cobori>, <scobori>, etc., are also Slavic
loans. Indeed, Slavic <to knock down> iz idiom <oboriti s nogu>. I
agree to that you are realy <borac> 'fighter'.

Konushevci
************

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alex" <alxmoeller@...> wrote:
> Abdullah Konushevci wrote:
>
> >> (12) oborî(to put down),-yes
>
> OK, one wants to see why I doubt about same of them. For instance
> "oborî" to put down is considered to be Slavic. You mean it is
Slavic
> too. I have my doubts because:
>
> -the verb has a tematic conjugation " obor, obori, oboarã" and it is
> usualy not aplayable to Slavic loans
> -there are the verbs "doborî" (to fell something down, to knock
down; to
> fell; (fig) to over-throw; to defeat) with unknown etymology
> - there is the verb "coborî" (to lower; (a înjosi) to debase vi to
go
> down/off; coborî de pe cal to dismount; (de pe munte) to climb
down; to
> descend; (din vehicul) to get out/off; (a apune) to set down; (d
> temperatura) to fall; (d preturi) to drop; (în zbor) to alight vr
to get
> off; (din) to get/go (out, of, from); (fig) to degrade oneself.The
> etymology of this one is too with unknon etymology, DEX means "see
> pogorî"
> -there is the verb "pogorî" which means the same as "coborî" and is
with
> unknown etymology too.
> -there is the verb "scoborî" with the same meaning as "coborî", just
> prefixed with "s-"
>
> The word "pogorî" seems to me to be Slavic. If one accept that
pogorî is
> a compound of Slavic po+gore (on mountain)
> then the verb "pogorî" appears to be Slavic indeed but the rest it
does
> not appear to be Slavic.
> About the rest, my opinion is that here one has to deal with the
root
> "bor-" here (extened with "c" in some exemples). This could reflect
a
> substratual word from /o/ grade of *PIE bher-, Pokorny #229 with the
> meaning of "erheben, aufheben" .
>
> One will ask why I consider this can be substratual one?
> I guess in Dacian we have some data for making maybe a connection.
( I
> say Dacian because just in Dacian space , not in the Thracian one I
have
> these testimonies).
> Thus , it is very possible that one word for "mountain" or "high
place"
> has been in Dacian "bor-" or "bur-".
> We have ancient topoynms in Dacia as "Buridava", Tribe name as
> "Buridavenses". The suffix "-ca" is for sure of substratual origin
and
> it is several time found in Dacian toponyms.What will make the
> connection with Dacian data and actual Romanian language?Well,
verbs as
> "aburca"= to go up on the mountains and toponyms as "Borcea" and
> "Borceni"
>
> I could not connect the presumabely *borc with Germanic "berg" from
PIE
> *bhereg^- because of "g" in Germanic, "g^" in PIe and "c" in
Romania.
>
> aburca; cf DEX unknown etymology: like "urca"
> urca : vt (scara) to mount; (un munte) to climb ; (preturile) to
raise;
> (a înalta) to put up vi to rise; (a crste) to grow up; (într-un) to
get
> up; cf DEX = maybe from Latin *oricare ( = oriri)
>
> Alex