Re: Ukrainian words from Carpathians

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "m_iacomi" <m_iacomi@...> wrote:

> george knysh wrote:
>
> > *****GK: Here's an interesting paragraph from B. Mahomedov's
> > recent book on the Chernyakhiv culture. It's from the chapter
> > discussing its ethnic components (under "Thracians and other
> > ethna"), at p.129: "Traces of a Thracian substrate have been
> > preserved.. in the languages of Carpathian Ukrainians [ref.
> > to a 1976 article by Desnitskaya]. These are the words:
> > vatra, koliba, tsaryna, gazda, barda, kiptar, virkolak
> > (vurdalak), koshara, tsap, brindza, mamalyga, palanka,
> > play, beskyd. The roots of similar words may be found
> > in Albanian, a Paleo-Balkanic language closest to the
> > ancient Thraco-Dacian tongues." Anything to that?*****
>
> Some of them seem to be loanwords from Romanian substrate words
> (most probably Dacian): "vatrã", "Tap", "brânzã". "Barda" is most
> probably a common loanword from Hungarian (also in Romanian),
> "kiptar" is by all means Romanian ("pectus" > "piept" deriving
> "pieptar" > "k'eptar" in Northern Dacoromanian), "colibã" exists
> in Romanian and Bulgarian too, could not be substrate for Rom.
> since one has preserved intervocalic /l/, might be Slavic. "Tarânã"
> should be inherited in Romanian as derived from Latin "terra".
> "gazda" is probably from Hungarian "gazda" (as well as in Rom.).
> "vârcolac" is Slavic loanword in Romanian (Bulg. "vãrkolak"), might
> have Romanian phonetism also in Ukrainian. "palanka" (also Rom.)
> should be another loanword from Hungarian "palánk". "Mãmãligã" is
> the Romanian national food, might be some derivative from "mama",
> it was borrowed also by other people. "Plai" is a Romanian word
> coming supposedly from Greek "plagion". For "koshara" one could
> see the Romanian suffix "-ar" attached to a Slavic loan word.
> For "beskyd" I have no suggestion. What does that mean?!
>
> Regards,
> Marius Iacomi

************
Because the question was addressed to Gasiarowski, I like to answer
only in two or three words.
As far as I remember, there are also place name Beskides and there
are all chances to be explained only through Alb. appellative
bjeshkë 'summer mountain pasture'. About pllaja 'grassy upland, high
plateau' I don't agree with above explanation, even it's common for
many authors. As first, suffix -ajë, -a is common in Alb. (cf. bisht-
ajë, dushk-ajë, mërr-ajë, gërdh-ajë, lisn-ajë, grun-ajë, etc.), so
the root or stem is pll-, probabely reduced form of Alb. pyll-ajë >
p&ll- + -ajë > pllajë. Furhtermore, this word is commonly used in
synonymic pair nëpër pllaja e kodrina 'through the woods and
hillocks'.
I hope that all will agree that Alb. vatra/votra < *a:ter was
borrowed in Serbo-Croatian, Rumanian, etc., for only in Alb. the
initial *a: and o* is turned in vo-/va- (cf. also vaj/voj < Lat.
oleum, i varfër/i vorfun < Lat. orphanus).

Konushevci