Re: corrections AN I.51-52

Dear Jim,
I know I misread you last night about the
prefix.Sorry!
I will like hear what Nina has to say
first.Dhammasangani did not say anything about
bhavanga directly but only from com.If the bhavanga
experience feeling ,it will mean it is not dreamless
.I will Try read VM in the citta part again.
I should say the 4 tiheuka,4 dvihetuka in kusala
javana will be the same in 8 bhavanga, patisandhi as a
human but it will be passive with no more kamma .I
agree with amara that
in VM give defination for 3 feeling into 89 citta.
You said bhavanga can experience the six aramanna but
i think this is only possible during patisandhi
rebirth like kamma sign,nimmita signs.Isn't that this
is the job of citta vithi in 10 vipaka causeless citta
and in kusala/akusala javana(in door like your said)
  How can it be?Bhavanga is only for the javana to
spring up?
-


- Jim Anderson <jimanderson_on@...> wrote:
> Dear Teng Kee,
>
> >Dear Jim,
> >It seems to me bhavanga is passive .Feeling are in
> >javana but not bhavangacitta. I read this in
> >Visuddhimagga.How can bhavanga experience
> something?
> >The feeling accompany in bhavanga will be the same
> in
> >8 kusala javana,9 rupa arupa and the other two but
> it
> >is passive as mentioned in VM.
>
> Perhaps by 'passive' you mean 'vipaaka' whereas
> 'kusala' and 'akusala' would
> be considered active (kamma). All 19 bhavangas are
> vipakas so yes I would
> agree with you about the bhavangas being passive if
> I've understood you
> correctly. However, I have to disagree with you
> about feeling not being in
> the bhavangacitta. The Dhammasangani describes each
> of the vipaakacittas
> that can function as a bhavangacitta as being
> accompanied by feeling. I'd
> like to know where in Vism you read that feeling is
> not in the
> bhavangacitta. All these bhavangacittas with the
> cetasikas can experience
> any one of the six arammanas although I think they
> would have to be past
> objects. I'm thinking that present objects could
> only be experienced through
> the doors. You then say "The feeling accompany in
> bhavanga will be the same
> in . . ." which contradicts your previous comment:
> "Feeling are in javana
> but not bhavangacitta." Have I misunderstood?
>
> Thanks for your previous message which I'm still
> studying and may comment
> on later. You didn't read my earlier message
> correctly when you wrote:
>
> << (abhidanapadipika gave 20 upassaga not 19.Maybe
> you
> misread ni and nii as one only) >>
>
> This is what I wrote to Nina:
>
> << Although there are only 20 prefixes (upasaggas)
> in Pali it can be
> difficult to know which of many meanings is
> applicable. In the
> Abhidhanapadipika 19 meanings are given for 'vi'
> alone while the Saddaniti
> gives 7 and PED gives 4. >>
>
> Actually, I got the '20' from the Saddaniti which
> turns out to be the same
> as in the Abhidhanappadipika. Please feel free to
> correct any mistake you
> see me making. Much appreciated.
>
> Best wishes,
> Jim
>
>
>
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