Re: AN1.15.1-28 A.t.thaana (1/5)

Dear Nina, Ole, Stephen and friends,

I am only trying to retain the ablative in the English, so that the
English is as close to the Pali as possible. I wonder if there is a
way we can achieve it.


Thanks to Nina for the enlightening explanation how anicca, dukkha
and anatta are presented here, in a different way. Also,

sa`nkhaara: conditioned phenomenon
dhamma: reality

As for a.t.thaana, I think PTS refers to anavakaasa when saying
impossible or not a chance. If you read the text carefully, it is a
double negation. I do not have PTS with me now, but I think it simply
resolves it and give it to the readers.

For example,

A.t.thaanameta.m, bhikkhave, anavakaaso ya.m di.t.thisampanno puggalo
ka~nci sa`nkhaara.m niccato upagaccheyya.

This is NOT the position, monks, it is impossible that a person
endowed with right views should regard any conditioned phenomenon as
NOT permanent.

[a.t.thanna and niccata provide the double negation]

I am guessing that PTS has something similar to metta.net like this:

Monks, it is impossible that a person endowed with right views should
regard any conditioned phenomenon as permanent.

[taking out a.t.thanna and changing niccata to nicca resolves the
double negation]

What do you think?


metta,
Yong Peng.

--- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Nina van Gorkom wrote:

Sa.nkhaara has different meanings depending on the context.
San.khaara dhammas are dhammas, phenomena, that are conditioned.
This, I think is the meaning here in this text. We have to think of
the saying: all conditioned phenomena are impermanent, dukkha, and
all dhammas are anattaa (including nibbaana).

Sa.nkhaarakkhanahda are all cetasikas except feeling and saññaa.
Further, there are still other meanings.

> 1. "A.t.thaanameta.m, bhikkhave, anavakaaso ya.m di.t.thisampanno
> puggalo ka~nci sa`nkhaara.m niccato upagaccheyya.
> "This is not the standpoint, monks: there is not a chance that,
> endowed with right views, a person should consider any determination
> as permanent.

N: Another option: PTS has; it is impossible, it cannot come to pass.
Standpoint is difficult to fit in here, I think.

instead of determination (for sa.nkhaara): phenomenon.

> 3. "A.t.thaanameta.m, bhikkhave, anavakaaso ya.m di.t.thisampanno
> puggalo ka~nci dhamma.m attato upagaccheyya.
> "This is not the standpoint, monks: there is not a chance that,
> endowed with right views, a person should consider anything as his
> own.

N: should consider any reality (dhamma) as the self. attato is the
ablative of attaa, self. The wrong view of self. This in paralel to
niccaa, sukha.