From: Torsten
Message: 68050
Date: 2011-09-18
><http://newstar.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/response.cgi?single=1&basename=/data/ie\
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Brian M. Scott" <bm.brian@> wrote:
> >
> > > MatasoviÃâ¡ also mentions French garenne 'rabbit-warren,
> > > fishing preserve', dialectal varenne 'wilderness' < Med.
> > > Lat. warenna (a feudal law term which designated a hunting
> > > preserve), as a possible loanword from Gaulish
> > > *war(r)enna:, as a derivated from the above root. Although
> > > he sees this etymology as "doubtful", he missed Old Irish
> > > ferann, ferenn 'field or grave surrrounded by a hedge or a
> > > stone wall' (Coromines), which secures it.
> >
> > That definition is over-specific. OIr <ferann> is 'land,
> > domain, territory, of a definite area, large or small',
> > generally used of land possessed by an individual, tribe, or
> > nation. The examples in the DIL clearly show this wide
> > range of application. OIr <ferenn> is 'a band or thong',
> > used of a belt or garter.
> >
> This reminds me of Old Irish fertae 'mound, tumulus' < Proto-Celtic
> *wert-ja: 'mound' (MatasoviÄ), a root also found in Middle Welsh
> gwerthyr 'fort' < *wert-ro- and gweryd 'earth, soil, grave' <
> *wereto-, derived from PIE *Hwer-
> suffix *-t- (e.g. Sanskrit vºrti- 'surrounding, covering; hedge,cf.
> fence'). Pokorny himself goes to the point of reconstructing a PIE
> form *wortom 'door'.
>
> Thus it would safer to place Gaulish *verenna: along with Old Irish
> ferenn < *werono- and feronn, ferann < *werono- as derivated from
> PIE *Hwer-. Clearly, this etymology can't explain neither the
> Wanderwort *waranda: nor Proto-Celtic *warra: 'post, prop', which
> would require a different (if any) PIE etymology.
>
> A good possibility could be *gWer(H)-u- 'spear, spit' > Latin
> veru:s, Proto-Celtic *beru-, assuming the evolutions gW > w and r(H)
> r(r) in the source languages. It's also worth mentioning the West
> Romance diminutive *berruculu- (Spanish berrojo, Gascon berrolh) 'a
> wooden or iron bar or bolt placed across gates on the inside', which
> Coromines though was an alteration of Latin veru:culum, but which
> IMHO is more likely linked to the Celtic word.
>