From: Torsten
Message: 65269
Date: 2009-10-20
>The -ova-, -uje- suffix creates verbs from nouns in Slavic languages. It is very common, bilinguals might have discarded it in translation.
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Torsten" <tgpedersen@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Try 'hunzen', now that you got your dictionaries open. It's
> > > supposedly from 'Hund', but AFAICS it's cognate with 'hunt'.
> >
> > Kluge s.v. <hunzen>:
> >
> > Ztw. nhd. zu Hund gebildet wie duzen, erzen, siezen zu du, Er,
> > Sie, somit urspr. 'Hund nennen', dann 'jem. wie einen Hund
> > behandeln'. So gehoert schwaeb. (ver)hundaasen 'miszhandeln' zum
> > Scheltwort Hundaas. Daen. <hundse> stammt aus dem Nhd. Vgl.
> > <verhunzen> [erst bei Causenmacher (Lpz. 1701) 62 "die Sache
> > verhunzen"].
> >
> > This seems to be the majority view. Friedrich Blatz, _Nhd.
> > Grammatik_, Bd. I, S. 711-2 (1900) has more details:
> >
> > Das Verbalsuffix -zen bildet Intensiva und Iterativa, ... dient
> > daher auch zur Bezeichnung wiederholter Toene oder Laute, z.B.
> > achzen (ach), ... siezen, duzen (mit du anreden) [auch mhd.],
> > ihrzen [mhd. irzen]. ... Ob hunzen, verhunzen von Hund kommt oder
> > slavischen Ursprungs ist, scheint zweifelhaft.
> >
> > This suffix goes back to OHG, e.g. <blecchazzen> 'blitzen', cf.
> > MDu <blicken> 'glaenzen'; <trophezzen> 'distillare', cf.
> > <tropho:n>, NHG <tropfen>; <chahhazzen> 'ridere' = OE
> > <ceahhettan>; also OE has <cohhettan> 'tussitare' from *cohhian,
> > cf. ME <coughen>, MDu <kuchen> 'to cough'. The suffix is Common
> > WGmc at least.
> >
> > Several other scholars cite the possible Slavic source as
> > Bohemian <huntowati> 'hunzen, zu Grunde richten, schlachten',
> > though not all consider this plausible. Hardly anyone wants to
> > derive <hunzen> from 'hunt'. It seems to me that a loanword
> > might well have been paretymologized as a derivative of <Hund>,
> > but without more digging I can say nothing about this <huntowati>.
>
> F. Weigand & F. Schmitthenner, Dt. Wb. I:712 (1873):
>
> hunzen = die Ehre abschneidend, spottend, scheltend behandeln ...
> Erst im 16. Jh., in welchem huntzen = durch Abschneiden kuerzen
> ["zuhuntzte ... Kleidung" (Mathesius, Sarepta Bl. 69{a}) = zu sehr
> gekuerzte], einscheinend kuerzen. Mit regelrechter Verschiebung
> des t zu z entlehnt aus boehm. huntovati, humtovati = verhunzen,
> aber huntowati eig. = schlachten.
>
> A. de Cihac, Dict. d'etym. daco-romane I:134 (1879):
>
> Ha^nt>uesc, i, vb., de'pe'cer, dilace'rer, de'membrer, de'chirer;
> -hant>, s., hant> de morta^ciune 'charogne'; cfr. c^ech. huntovati
> 'faire le me'tier de boucher', hunt 'grand morceau'; l'all. hunzen,
> aushunzen 'gourmander' est de la me^me source c^ech.
>
> J.F. S^umavske'ho, C^esko-Nemecky slovnik 164 (1851):
>
> Hunt, u 'Stuerzkarren; Knollen, groszes Stuekk; Klotz zu Schindeln;
> groszes Holzscheit'; --e'r^ 'Landfleischhauer, Steckviehhaendler;
> Verderber, Sudler'; ... --e'r^uju 'Landfleischhauer sein'.
>
> Kluge seems to have been unaware of "zuhuntzte Kleidung"; this
> 16th-c. sense of <huntzen> can hardly come from 'Hund nennen'.
> However a loan from the Czech form <huntovati> should not have lost
> the second syllable; we have 15th-c. Ger. <hauf(e)nitz> 'howitzer'
> from Boh. <houfnice> 'stone-sling, catapult'. More likely Boh.
> <hunte'r^> was borrowed into early NHG as *Huntzer 'meat-cutter,
> butcher' and the verb <huntzen> was back-formed, literally 'to cut
> meat, butcher, hack to pieces, cut short' etc., figuratively 'to
> cut down to size, belittle, die Ehre abschneiden, spotten,
> schelten, schimpfen'.
> I do not know the source of this Czech <hunt> 'piece, lump', etc.Somehow the whole thing looks hunt-related, the last quotes having to do with dissecting the quarry, cf 'Unmaking' in