From: tgpedersen
Message: 62259
Date: 2008-12-22
>Rick McCallister:
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "tgpedersen" <tgpedersen@> wrote:
> >
> > > > > In Joz^ef S^avli/Matej Bor: Unsere Vorfahren die Veneter
> > > > > (review of the English translation here:
> > > > > http://tinyurl.com/6jn43n )
> >
> > Here are the alleged Breton - Slovenian correspondent words (pp.
> > 339-343, translated
> >
> > It is of course interesting which of the words are only Breton and
> > Slovenian and which are generally Celtic and Slavic, respectively.
> > Comments are appreciated.
>
> ...
>
> > bistro, adj. (lait) qui file; milk (flowing). The word is very
> > interesting, since the Slov. bister bistra bistro (Old Slavic
> > bystrU) at the same time means fast, lively, agile and also clear.
> > "The idea of being rapid is also connected with the idea of
> > clearness" (Plet.). Eg. bistra voda (flowing and clear water).
> > Both meaning nuances exist in Russian. Wrt. to the Breton bistro
> > the French Etym. Dictionary notes: "mot obscur". If we explain it
> > on the basis of the Slavic and Slovenian vocabulary, bistro is no
> > longer an obscure word, but quite clear: bistro is the desk,
> > where clear, original (bistro) milk and later wine was served.
>
> Zbigniew Gol/a,b,
> The Origins of the Slavs, pp. 126-7, 140, 141
>
> 'But before that we should still discuss the problem of the North IE
> vocabulary as reflected by Germanic, Baltic, and Slavic
> correspondences. In the preceding chapter we mentioned some
> phonemic and morphemic features which characterize the
> prehistorical North-European dialectal zone of Proto-Indo-European,
> i.e. the zone including later (historical) Germanic, Baltic, and
> Slavic languages. But, as usually is the case with dialectal
> phenomena, we can also find in this zone many common prehistorical
> lexical phenomena, the so-called North-European lexical
> dialectisms.14 Most of these lexical dialectisms undoubtedly come
> from a time when the linguistic ancestors of the Slavs, Baits, and
> Teutons dwelt close to each other, as a group of neighboring tribes
> somewhere in Eastern Europe, probably in the third millenium B.C.
> So we may be dealing here with the so-called areal phenomena: a
> word formed in one dialect, let us say, in Pre-Germanic or
> Pre-Balto-Slavic, could penetrate other dialects of the zone
> because social contacts (e.g. barter trade between the respective
> tribes) made this possible.
> The problem of the North European lexical dialectisms in question
> has been recently treated in a special study by Chr. Stang (1972).
> What follows is a critical survey of Stangs material with
> supplements from C^emodanov (1962) and Trubac^ev (1966) whose books
> did not reach Stang's attention. Facts of Slavic will often be
> illustrated with additional data from Berneker's, Vasmer's, and
> other dictionaries.
> The special lexical correspondences among Germanic, Baltic, and
> Slavic (henceforth Germc. ~ Balto-Slav.) should be divided into
> three subgroups: 1. Germc. ~ Balto-Slav., i.e. words common to all
> three linguistic groups; 2. Germc. ~ Baltic, i.e. words common to
> Germanic and Baltic only; 3. Germc. ~ Slavic, i.e. words common to
> Germanic and Slavic only. It is obvious that for our purposes the
> second subgroup is not important, and can be omitted. So we shall
> review words common to all three linguistic groups, and those
> common to Germc. and Slavic only.
> ...
> II. Germc. ~ Slavic
> ...
> 8.) bystrU 'quick', attested in all Slavic languages, e.g.
> OCS bystrU, 'schnell, verschlagen',
> Russ. býstryj 'schnell, scharfsichtig',
> S-C b`ìstar 'klar' (cf. bìstrica as a frequent hydronym),
> Pol. bystry 'reissend, schnell', etc..
>
> OIc. bysja 'mit grosser Gewalt ausströmen',
> Norw. dial. busa 'hervorstürzen':
>
> PIE archetype for Slavic *bhu:s-ro-
> (Stang 16, see also Berneker 113).'
>
>
> DEO:
> buse v., no. d.s., sv. busa, mnty. bu:sen 'svire' [carouse], ty.
> bausen, 'svulme; svire', eng. bouse 'svire', østfris. bu:sen 'være
> voldsom, bruse, larme, storme'; jf en afledt form som no.dial.,
> oldnord. bysja 'strømme, fare frem,' og en aflydende som no.dial.
> bøysa 'buse frem' ...
>
> Since in some river names we have /u/ > /i/,
> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/59166
> (the Kuhn quote)
> I added:
>
> bister adj., ænyda. no., sv. d.-s.;
> lån fra mnty. bi:ster 'omflakkende [vagrant], vildfarende [errant],
> forvildet, forvirret, barsk'; måske en afledning til III bisse.
> ...
> III. bisse v. 'løbe vildt afsted el. omkring; flakke om';
> glda. bis(s)e, da.dial. bese, sv besa, mnty bis(s)en, oldhty.
> biso:n, ty. biesen; jf oldhty. bi:sa 'nordøstvind'. ...
>
>
> Now *that*, I think, needs a really good explanation
>
> I seem to remember that the Breton word for "lively" begins withDictionnaire Breton-Français du Dialecte de Vannes
> bis-, I saw this when I was looking at Basque bizi.