From: tgpedersen
Message: 58462
Date: 2008-05-13
>Well, that's what Wiki says, so it's received wisdom. The question I'd
>
> --- tgpedersen <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
>
> >
> > This puzzles me:
> > In Jürgen Udolph
> > Die Stellung der Gewässernamen Polens
> > innerhalb der alteuropäischen Hydronymie, p. 112,
> > I find (my transl.)
> > "Already at the beginning of the century J.
> > Rozwadowski had pointed to
> > onomastic parallels, the oldest attempt AFAIK comes
> > from R. Ferguson
> > (The River-Names of Europe, London etc 1862, p.
> > 141), who - besides
> > erroneous results - also connected Drwe,ca/Drewenz
> > [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drw%C4%99ca ]
> > and Durance/Druentia.
> > [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durance ]
> > The following names are closely connected with those
> > of
> > Drwe,ca/Drewenz (zero grade + -nt- suffix and full
> > grade + -nt-
> > suffix, respectively):
> > 1. Druantia, now Durance, left trib. of the Rhône,
> > with toponym Druantium and adj. (nautae) Druentici.
> > 2. *Druantia, now Drance/Dranse, left trib. of the
> > Rhône,
> > with three source rivers Drance.
> > 3. *Druantia, now Drance/Dranse, trib. of the Lac
> > Léman.
> > 4. *Druantia, now Drouance, river in Normandy.
> > 5. *Druentia, analyzed out of the toponym (Forum)
> > Druentinorum in the
> > Aemilia.
> > 6. *Dru(w)n.tos (or long root vowel ?) in the
> > Byeloruss. lake name
> > Drywiaty.
> > 7. *Dravant- in the present river name Trionto in
> > Lower Italy.
> > 8. *Dravant- in the (now disused) river name
> > Trounsach, 1350
> > Trounsach, 1351 dronsach, druonsach, a trib. of the
> > Iller.
> >
> > As the compunds show, zero grade formations with a
> > suffix -ant-
> > predominate, beside them appear full grade names
> > extended with the
> > formant *-n.t-, among which - as W.P. Schmid has
> > shown - zero grade is
> > frequent. The geographical distribution should be
> > noted: the three
> > East Prussian and Byelorussian names, beside a
> > number of occurrences
> > in Italy and Normandy, are matched by three
> > hydronyms in Southern
> > France and Western Switzerland."
> >
> > OK, so typical Old European, ie. in this
> > interpretation Venetic names.
> > How come these are left out of the list:
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Derwent
> > eg this one
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derwent_Water
> > (in which there is mysterious fish called the
> > vendace
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coregonus_vandesius
> > http://www.thefreedictionary.com/vendace
> > )?
> >
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> Derwent is from the Celtic word for "oak", right? BUT
> it's a compound word < dVr- "tree, etc." + went. So
> are you saying Derwent et al represent "beloved tree"?
> and vendace "beloved fish"? --I would have guessed its
> skin was made into bags for Vendôme and Versace
> boutiques ;>