Re: Priimary Stem Formants: =*H, -*i/y, *-u/w

----- Original Message -----
From: "Piotr Gasiorowski" <gpiotr@...>
To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:56 PM
Subject: Re: [tied] RE: Priimary Stem Formants: =*H, -*i/y, *-u/w


> On 2008-04-08 16:26, Patrick Ryan wrote:
>
> > Have the scholars who postulated an initial *H2 in *yeu-, 'young', by
> > any
> > chance looked as *yeu-, 'mix'?
>
> There is no *jeu- 'young'. The surviving cognates show that *//h2jew-//
> was originally acrostatic (nom.sg. *h2óju, gen. *h2áju-s ~ *h2áiw-os,
> later also *h2jéu-s on the analogy of mobile (proterokinetic) stems. The
> verb root *jeu- has its vowel in a different interconsonantal slot and I
> don't know of any good evidence for an initial laryngeal.
>
> > I suspect an initial *H2 here.
> >
> > As for *H2ayo-, 'vital force', and *H2ayew-, it is instructive to look
> > at
> > *H2aw-, 'wet' and *H2aw, 'blow'.
>
> I have grave doubts about the validity of anything like Pokorny's
> "*au(e)- 'benetzen, befeuchten, fließen'." At any rate there's certainly
> no initial laryngeal in *wed- (*wod-r./*wed-n.-). The 'blow' root is
> definitely *h2weh1-.
>
> > From my work, I know, but common sense will
> > tell you that *H2 there derives from two different 'laryngeals': once *H
> > associated with 'water', the other *H associated with 'air.
>
> There is, admittedly, something onomatopoeic about *//h2weh1-// 'blow'
> and possibly *//h2enh1-// 'breathe', though the PIE status of both is
> guaranteed by their wide distibution and ample attestation. Actually, if
> a root is transparently imitative, it's likely to be relatively young,
> since the onomatopoeic effect diminishes over time as a result of sound
> change (Eng. wind or Fr. vent have practically lost it). But in
> principle the relationship between sound and meaning is arbitrary and
> there is no reason why the same *h2 should not have occurred in "watery"
> roots such as *//h2ep-//.
>
> Piotr

***

Sorry, I think that makes no sense at all.

Air and water could not been farther apart.

There is a clearly definable group of words like *Ha(:)p- that clearly
belong to *Ha(:) (your *H2), 'water'.

Another, like *Ha(:)n6-, that belong to *Ha(:), 'air'.

Yet another *H2 is involved in family member names *Ha(:)m(m)Ha(:), which
means 'nuclear family, here'.

Feminine -H2e (my -*Ha(:) belongs to the second group.

Collective -*H2e (my -*Ha(:) belongs to the first group.

The frequent -*H2e (my -*Ha(:) in verbal stems belongs to the third group;
it is stative.

It also is present in the first person singular of the PIE perfect.



Patrick

***