> --- tgpedersen <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
> > From Gibbon's "History Of The Decline And Fall Of
> > The Roman Empire",
> > vol 1:
> > "
> > [Footnote *: The Bastarnae cannot be considered
> > original inhabitants
> > of Germany
>
> GK: Not in their historical haunts.
****GK: If the Sciri mentioned in the Olbia
Prothogenes Decree as allies of "Galati" and a menace
to the security of the state ca. 240 BCE became a
component of the Bastarnae, it might be interesting to
investigate whether they and their "point of origin"
are mentioned in other classical sources. There is
nothing about them in Tacitus, but his listings are
not exhaustive (either as to names or localities). We
seem to have a reference in Pliny, but this has
frequently been interpreted as a mention of otherwise
unknown Baltic groups living east of the Vistula. Here
is the passage:
"
sinum, qui Codanus vocatur, refertus insulis, quarum
clarissima est Scatinavia, inconpertae magnitudinis,
portionem tantum eius, quod notum sit, Hillevionum
gente quingentis incolente pagis: quare alterum orbem
terrarum eam appellant. nec minor est opinione
Aeningia. [prob. Finland GK]
97 quidam haec habitari ad Vistlam usque fluvium a
Sarmatis, Venedis, Sciris, Hirris tradunt, sinum
Cylipenum vocari et in ostio eius insulam Latrim, mox
alterum sinum Lagnum, conterminum Cimbris.
promunturium Cimbrorum excurrens in maria longe
paeninsulam efficit, quae Tastris appellatur. XXIII
inde insulae Romanis armis cognitae." (NH, IV, 96-97)
Pliny appears to be (roughly) describing the eastern
Baltic, circling it from and to Jutland. The "Sciri"
are, at first glance, indeed reported as located
somewhere east of the Vistula. But there are
difficulties with this. If the reading is accepted as
is, we must conclude that Pliny had nothing to say
about the area between the "sinus Cylipenus", close to
Jutland, and the Vistula. But what if there is a
lacuna in the manuscript? That this is a viable
hypothesis is indicated by another passage just a few
lines down from our context:
"Germanorum genera quinque: Vandili, quorum pars
Burgodiones, Varinnae, Charini, Gutones. alterum genus
Inguaeones, quorum pars Cimbri, Teutoni ac Chaucorum
gentes.
100 proximi autem Rheno Istuaeones, quorum . . . . .
mediterranei Hermiones, quorum Suebi, Hermunduri,
Chatti, Cherusci. quinta pars Peucini, Basternae,
supra dictis contermini Dacis. amnes clari in oceanum
defluunt Guthalus, Visculus sive Vistla, Albis,
Visurgis, Amisis, Rhenus, Mosa." (NH, IV, 99-100)
Something is clearly missing [this has been pointed
out by Pliny editors] between "quorum" and
"mediterranei" (=an enumeration of the Istuaeones),
and the river names in par. 100 demonstrate that Pliny
was indeed familiar with the coastline between Jutland
and Vistula.
Perhaps the following solution might be suggested as
to IV, 97:
"quidam haec habitari ad Vistlam usque fluvium a
Sarmatis, Venedis,.... Sciris, Hirris tradunt, sinum
Cylipenum vocari et in ostio eius insulam Latrim, mox
alterum sinum Lagnum, conterminum Cimbris."
This would mean that both "Sciri" and "Hirri" are,
according to Pliny, to be located not east of the
Vistula, but west thereof, very close to Jutland. His
listing of the "in betweens" has fallen out. And these
would be the Sciri who did not participate in the
"Bastarnian" exodus of the 3rd c.BCE, and were still
"in situ" in the old Jastorf area (now a thing of the
past) in 75 CE. These might well be the Sciri who
resurfaced in the 5th century in Jordanes' Gothic
history (sects. 242,275-7).****
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