Re: Bird

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "fournet.arnaud" <fournet.arnaud@...>
wrote:

>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: stlatos
> To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 10:51 PM
> Subject: [Courrier indésirable] [tied] Bird (was: Renfrew's theory

renamed as Vasco-Caucasian)

> Here's my explanation (simplified to be more like standard, thus
> leaving some parts out). See some of my previous descriptions for

more.

>
> *ptero+ 'wing'
> *pteryo+ 'at/on/in wing'
>
> *petno+ 'feather'
> *petnyo+ 'at/on/in feather'
>
> like:
>
> *kY(e)rd 'heart'
> *kY(e)rdi 'at/on/in heart'
>
> *ekYspteryó/ekYspetnyó+ 'out from under wing'
> *ekYspteryó/ekYspetnyó+s 'fledgling'
>
> From PIE to:
>
> *ekYspetnyó+ > *essidnyo+ > *essi:ne/isse:ne > MIr essíne, Gaelic
> isean 'young bird, chicken'
>
> =====
> The idea is very creative.
> From H1_ks-p_tn-yó should it not be *assanni- in proto-Celtic ?
> Unstressed > hence schwa > *a
> ARnaud
> =================

I do not believe that:

1. prepositions like *en, *ekYs began with *h1 (though it seems
certain for most verbs)

2. e-stress > 0 or reduced V in all positions

3. a final high tone meant no tone on any other syllable

4. tn > nn (rather Vtn > V:n)

5. yo()# > i (rather Cyo() > Cy > Ce)

> *ekYspteryó+
> *ekYpteryó+
> *ekYpretyó+
> *epretyó+
> *ephrethyó+
> *ebhredhyó+
> *ebredyó+
> *ebredyá+
> *ibridyá+
> *bridyá+
>
> OE bridd / bird 'young bird, chicken'
> =======
> Germanic is not a variety of PIE where consonants are unstable.
> I don't believe in most steps of this sequence.
> Arnaud
> ===============

The correspondence is according to Verner's Law; the intermediate
steps don't matter for this word. I have a different sequence from
others, explained before.

The loss of s between stops and outcome of k()p or k()pr, etc., are
hard to evaluate as there aren't any certain cases for most possible
clusters.


The existence of essíne, regarded as from something like
*ekYspetnyó+ for over 100 years, makes a similar derivation for bridd
more likely. From these clues:

1. dd would likely come from *dj; the preservation of i not *e also
indicates this : Ir -e

2. metathesis in a cluster like kspt created at a morpheme boundary
is fully understandable

3. words for 'feather' and 'bird' both having all 3 C able to come
from PIE p-t-r makes a connection likely

4. 2 words with the same meaning in neighboring branches which share
some vocabulary and contain borrowings from each other are more likely
to be from the same original. The Celtic one has a certain origin,
the OE uncertain; if they can be linked by the similarities mentioned
a different origin would be extremely unlikely.

> á é í ó ú à è ò ì ù È Ó
> æ ø å ä ë ï ö ü ő ű
> þ ð ç s z
> ==========
> What do you mean ?
> Arnaud
> ==============

This has no meaning. I was checking to see what symbols would show
up on the homepage before putting any unusual ones in and accidentally
left it in.