[tied] Re: Mater theia

From: Daniel J. Milton
Message: 33787
Date: 2004-08-16

Where did I get the idea that Lat. /mundus/ was a calque
on Greek /kosmos/? No idea, it's something I read a long time ago.
But before I posted yesterday I checked Lewis & Short and
found the adjective /mundus/ "clean, cleanly, nice, neat, elegant"
(Sansc. /mund-/ "purificari"), followed by the noun /mundus/ "all
her toilet, [1. mundus], toilet ornaments, decorations, dress (of a
woman)", Transf. "like the Gr. /kosmos/, "the universe, the world"
and "Euphemistically for the Lower World, the infernal regions. The
opening into this mundus was at Rome, in the Comitium, and was kept
covered with a stone (lapis manalis); three times in the year, on
the 24th of August, the 5th of October, and the 8th of November,
days sacred to the gods of the infernal regions, this round pit was
opened, and all sorts of fruits were thrown into it as offerings".
I also see Pokorny 1309 "meu-1, meu_@- : mu:>-
English meaning: wet; dirt; to wash, etc.", with "aus *mu-n-d-os (-d-
zur Wurzelerw. meu-d-) in der Bed. `gewaschen' auch lat. mundus
`schmuck, sauber, rein, nett', Subst. `Putz der Frauen; Weltordnung,
Weltall' (nach gr. /kosmos/).
The parallelism seems too much of a coincidence for
the Latin not to be a calque on the Greek metaphor that today causes
confusion between cosmology and cosmetology, with no involvement of
Etruscan. But there is Etruscan and the site you refer to
http://etruscans1.tripod.com/Language/EtruscanM.html has:
mun-, muni, muni-s, muni-s-ta-s, muni-cle-th, muni-cle-t, muni ule-
th, muni-vle-th, mun-sle, mun-th "place, hypogeal place, tomb" [cw
43, g/lb83, mp68, pa, dep]
munth "adornment, order" [g/lb83, mp68: 369]
"honoring" < "lofty deed" [az96]
munthu "one who polishes" [az96]
munthux, munthx, munthu "female attendant to deities"
[g/lb83] "elegance, Munda (allegory)" [az96]
see Latin mundus "women's cosmetics, world" [cw 43, g/lb83, mp68, pa]
calque of Greek kosmos "order, female adornment, world order,
universe" [cw 43, g/lb83, mp68]
see Latin monumentum "tomb" [dep].
I'm not sure what the writer is implying, but we seem
to have two themes, "the hypogeal place, tomb", which doesn't match
Greek or Latin (except that triennial opening) and the "adornment,
polishing, elegance", which matches the basic meaning as well as the
form of the Latin.

Your reference
http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/bmcr/1997/97.03.26.html
says "the Roman Mundus was a subterranean pit which was opened
three times a year (Aug. 24, Oct. 5, and Nov. 8). W. Warde Fowler
long ago demonstrated that these rites were originally connected
with the end of the summer harvest and the fall planting of wheat
and barley, but at some time the Mundus lost its agricultural
meaning and was associated with the Underworld.2 This latter
interpretation probably resulted from the fact that the term Mundus
actually derived from or was equated with Etruscan mun, muni
= 'undergroundchamber', 'tomb'. " Note that he hedges on "derived
from" with "was equated". My guess is that the pit WAS the mundus
rather than the opening to the subterranean mundus=world as L&S
would have it, and this is meaning is taken directly from the
Etruscan. But is this an independent word from
the Latin /mundus/ "clean", transf. "world"? Does the later
derive from the Etruscan rather being I.-E.? Are the
Etruscan "tomb" and "adornment" words related to each other or not?

So there seems to be a number of open questions. But
Latin /mundus/ "world" being a calque on Greek /kosmos/ appears to
stand.
Dan Milton