From: tgpedersen
Message: 33218
Date: 2004-06-12
> On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 11:55:55 +0000, tgpedersent-
> <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
>
> >Löpelmann:
> >ets^e "house"
> >
> >because of the compounds
> >ets^alondo
> >ets^alain
> >ets^alte
> >he posits an original root
> >*ets^al-
> >variants
> >*ets^ar-/*ets^er-
>
> etxalte is a local variant of etxalde "village house, own
> house" from etxe + alde "side, near". I can't find
> <etxalain> in Azkue, but a suffix *-ain does not exist.
> Lapurdian etxalondo means the same as etxalde, and is
> clearly composed of etxe + ondo "side, near", which should
> have given *etxaondo. Perhaps this was transformed to
> etxalondo by analogy of <etxalde>. In any case, there is
> ansolutely no reason to posit an original root
> *etxal-/*etxar-, and no possible way that such a root could
> have developed into general Basque <etxe> (combining form of
> course <etxa->).
>
> Now a pre-Basque word *(t)egi "house", combining form
> *(t)eg-, when combined with the diminutive suffix -xe would
> have given *(t)eg-xe > etxe regularly.
>
> >further
> >tegi "Dach, jede überdachte Raum, Schutzort, Schuppen, Stall,
> >Speicher, Hütte, Schrein, Aufbewahrungsort, Kasten, Truhe,
> >geschütztes Lager etc"
> >
> >combining form
> >-tegi "Lager, Stall, Scutzort, Haus, Laden usw."
> >
> >Nbf. (side forms) -thegi, tei, -hei
> >
> >Aus dem Gall: lat. attegia "Hütte, Zelt";
> >aus dem kelt: altligur. tegia "Hütte", ebenso
> >wenn nicht aus dem Lat.: tirol. thei "Alpenhütte"
> >
> >
> >in other words, Löpelman does not see a connection between
> ><etxe> "house" and tegi "roof (also house)".
>
> I would think not: *I* discovered that.
>
> >The latter, which he
> >lists as a separate word, not a combining form, has initial t- and
> >must therefore (since it's not a combining form and therefore the
> >is in anlaut of the word) be a recent loan, later than the Latinones
> >at that. Why are you representing <tegi> as a combining form ofI applaud your costumary ingenuity, but isn't that a rather small
> ><etxe>?
>
> The word <tegi> is similar to English word "ism" or the
> Dutch word <tig>. See Trask tHoB, p. 192:
>
> "The suffix -<koi> 'fond of' has yielded in Z[uberoan] an
> independent adjective <khoi> 'inclined (to do something)',
> and teh suffix -<kume> 'offspring' has in B[izkaian] given
> rise to a word <kume> 'offspring (of an animal)' which now
> contrasts with the historically realted <ume> 'child'.
> Since teh eighteenth century, the very common suffix
> -<tasun> '-ness' has been used as a noun <tasun> 'quality';
> in the modern language this even forms derivatives like
> <tasunezko> 'qualitative'. The anomalously formed words
> <talde> 'group', <toki> 'place' and one or two others in
> this vein [such as <tegi> --mcv], with their initial
> voiceless plosives, likewise result from the generalization
> of what were originally bound second elements"
>