--- In
cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "elmeras2000" <jer@...> wrote:
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Wordingham"
> <richard.wordingham@...> wrote:
>
> [JER:]
> > > "The owner of which" would be the genitive of the relative
> > > pronoun which has not been brought into this yet.
> >
> > No, it would be an 'antigenitive', a construct state.
>
> Yes, I'm beginning to see that, though it feels *very* awkward.
And
> I do not really understand that a relative pronoun could be the
> thing owned by anybody or anything.
In this respect, apart from case (or whatever) the relative clause
if not very different from 'which the wolf has',
> This funny thing, "antigenitive", would require to be combined
with
> a genitive, would it not? In that case *wlkWos- (with pronouns,
*tes-
> ) would be a genitive. Is this right?
In the construction I have in mind, *wlkWos would be the subject,
and thus in the nominative; we have here a clause. It may be that
this construction does not occur in any language; we seem to lack
interested students of grammar.
In the normal possessor + possession _phrase_, I don't think there
is a fixed rule as to whether the possessor needs to be marked io
the possession is marked. In Chickasaw, the possessor is unmarked,
and both the antigenitive and other case markings may be attached to
the possession. I think the same applies to Basque, but I could be
wrong.
In Arabic, the possessor is in the genitive, and case markers are
applied to the construct form. In Hebrew, there are no case
markers, and where _possession_ is not indicated by the
construction, the suffixes for pronominal possessors are added to
the noun not in the construct.
Hungarian has a sort of anti-genitive; the construct is
possessor[-GEN] + possession-HIS
HIS = 3rd person possessive suffix.
GEN = 'genitive' ( = 'dative') marker
Note the optionality of the marking.
In the English analogues I gave, the possessor is nominative or
accusative.
It occurred to me that tatpurushas might be examples. When the
first element is a thematic stem, why does the thematic vowel
surface as -o- rather than as -e-?
Richard.