Re: Ban_Pan_

----- Original Message -----
From: g
To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003
Subject: [tied] Re: Ban_Pan
...
I'd rather doubt that the German(ic) word "Bann" prompted the
creation of "ban", as a title/rank/profession. I'd rather expect
the "ban" to be a mere variant of "pan" and "zhupan".
...
George
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Well, I would say that PAN is excluded because the S Slavs [croats, serbs]
do not have it their vocabulary.

Zhupan is a separate discussion; among the croats existed Zhupan_Grand
Zhupan in the same time with the BAN. If you can demonstrate linguistically
a contraction ZHUPAN (ie JUPan)_Ban I would be more than glad to see your
arguments.

In 200 years [~620-~800] a lot of leaders of the S Slavs are known and among
them are a lot of Zhupan_Grand Zhupan's. But the BAN emerge only after the
contact with the Carolingian Empire. The croats are not the only example; as
I said on 9 May, there are other 2 cases where this phenomena occurred.

S o r i n