Re: [tied] English "voiced" stops

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick C. Ryan" <proto-language@...> wrote:

> > >>> Ladefoged is simply wrong on "most" though, I admit, it
> > >>> obviously happens in ethnic enclaves.

> > Once again: Of what kind(s)?

> California has many Asian communities, the native languages of
> whom are characterized by voiceless unaspirated and aspirated
> stops (for example, many (if not virtually all) dialects of
> Chinese). I will bet that you can, just through general knowledge,
> come up with a few more.

But why should I? (1) I have no reason to think that California's
Asian communities have significantly affected California English.
(2) I have no reason to think that Ladefoged's own data on U.S.
English are taken from native Californians. (3) I know that his
conclusions are not based solely on his own data.

The objection was fairly ridiculous from the start, but I confess
that I was a bit curious to see what you'd say when pressed.

[...]

> The real point, however, is that not all experts are expert.

Indeed. You'll find it hard, however, to convince anyone that
this particular expert isn't.

Brian