Re: Krak and his dragon

Has anyone thought of a possible Celtic origin for Cracow? Might it
have been one of the Celtic placenames that survived from the Celtic
era in Poland? As I recall, Celtic cognates mean things like rock,
rocky ravine, rocky outcrop, rock quarry, etc. Does this describe the
vicinity of Cracow?

--- In cybalist@..., tgpedersen@... wrote:
> --- In cybalist@..., tgpedersen@... wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In cybalist@..., tgpedersen@... wrote:
> > >
> > > > But this guy
> > > >
> > > > http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&selm=cea20-
> > > > ya02408000R2501990120540001%40nntp-serv.cam.ac.uk
> > > >
> > > > maintains that Hrólfr Kraki was actually a Herulian named
> Rodulf,
> > > > that he appears in many guises in many sources, and that he
> lived
> > > in
> > > > southeastern Europe. Geographically we're getting closer now.
> Is
> > it
> > > > possible after all to mesh in the Polish story into this web
of
> > > > stories?
> > > >
> > > > Torsten
> >
> > --- In cybalist@..., "Piotr Gasiorowski" <gpiotr@...> wrote:
> > > He doesn't actually say so. He only speaks about the story of
> > Rodulf
> > > the Herulian having been absorbed into the Danish tradition and
> > > applied to Hrólfr Kraki of Denmark. Kraki may mean 'thin pole',
> but
> > > not 'thin Pole'. Nevertheless, it's interesting to note that
such
> a
> > > nickname (*krako:(n) is attested in Germanic. Maybe our
legendary
> > > Krak was a Vandalic leader (his daughter's name was Wanda).
> > >
> > > Piotr
> > >
> > The alternative explanation is that there was only one person and
> > that his by-name was actually Kraki, which was only preserved in
> the
> > Danish (and Polish?) tradition. Saxo's explanation of the name
> sounds
> > like one of those after-rationalisations most chroniclers come up
> > with when faced with an unfamiliar name (Oidipus = "stung-foot").
> > But if he founded Krakow, he must have been a South Pole? (Please
> > ignore this sentence).
> >
> I don't think either Wessén or Lukman let Hrólfr Kraki survive as
an
> independent entity. Perhaps one should take into account the
> traditional derivation of the name of the town Roskilde (close to
> Lejre, the place of Hrólr Kraki) as from Hrólfr
and 'kilde' "spring,
> well" (German 'Quelle'). Roas? (local pronunciation: ro?&skil&,
older
> spelling Roeskilde).
> Georg Søndergaard: Danske Efternavn [Danish Surnames]:
> "Krag 622 [people of that name in Denmark] Danish tilnavn
> [nickname?], medieval Kraack "krage [crow]", common everywhere in
> Denmark since the Middle Ages [in Denmark, that is after the Viking
> Age]. Jutish noble family."
> I have not been able to verify Old Da. 'kraack' "crow" in the
> dictionaries I've consulted.
> Why *krako:n?
>
> > Torsten