Re: Krak and his dragon

--- In cybalist@..., tgpedersen@... wrote:

> >
> > --- In cybalist@..., tgpedersen@... wrote:
> >
> > > But this guy
> > >
> > > http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&selm=cea20-
> > > ya02408000R2501990120540001%40nntp-serv.cam.ac.uk
> > >
> > > maintains that Hrólfr Kraki was actually a Herulian named

Rodulf,

> > > that he appears in many guises in many sources, and that he

lived

> > in
> > > southeastern Europe. Geographically we're getting closer now.

Is

> it
> > > possible after all to mesh in the Polish story into this web of
> > > stories?
> > >
> > > Torsten
>
> --- In cybalist@..., "Piotr Gasiorowski" <gpiotr@...> wrote:
> > He doesn't actually say so. He only speaks about the story of
> Rodulf
> > the Herulian having been absorbed into the Danish tradition and
> > applied to Hrólfr Kraki of Denmark. Kraki may mean 'thin pole',

but

> > not 'thin Pole'. Nevertheless, it's interesting to note that such

a

> > nickname (*krako:(n) is attested in Germanic. Maybe our legendary
> > Krak was a Vandalic leader (his daughter's name was Wanda).
> >
> > Piotr
> >
> The alternative explanation is that there was only one person and
> that his by-name was actually Kraki, which was only preserved in

the

> Danish (and Polish?) tradition. Saxo's explanation of the name

sounds

> like one of those after-rationalisations most chroniclers come up
> with when faced with an unfamiliar name (Oidipus = "stung-foot").
> But if he founded Krakow, he must have been a South Pole? (Please
> ignore this sentence).
>

I don't think either Wessén or Lukman let Hrólfr Kraki survive as an
independent entity. Perhaps one should take into account the
traditional derivation of the name of the town Roskilde (close to
Lejre, the place of Hrólr Kraki) as from Hrólfr and 'kilde' "spring,
well" (German 'Quelle'). Roas? (local pronunciation: ro?&skil&, older
spelling Roeskilde).
Georg Søndergaard: Danske Efternavn [Danish Surnames]:
"Krag 622 [people of that name in Denmark] Danish tilnavn
[nickname?], medieval Kraack "krage [crow]", common everywhere in
Denmark since the Middle Ages [in Denmark, that is after the Viking
Age]. Jutish noble family."
I have not been able to verify Old Da. 'kraack' "crow" in the
dictionaries I've consulted.
Why *krako:n?

> Torsten