--- In qalam@yahoogroups.com, "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@...>
wrote:

> suzmccarth wrote:

>
> "In both alphabets [i.e. what we call Brahmi and Kharosthi] the
> fundamental vowel â, which in Indian languages constitutes thirty-

five

> per cent. of all the vowels, is not expressed at all, except at the
> beginning of words, being regarded as inherent in the preceding
> consonant. In both alphabets the other medial vowels are expressed

by a

> short stroke (-) attached to the covering consonant, and varying in
> position according to the nature of the vowel to be denoted."

(2:303

> n.1)
>
> There is nothing at all else on the writing of vowels although he

has 60

> more pages on Indian and Farther Indian alphabets.

Thanks for the Isaac Taylor stuff. I had expected more.

Here is Philippe Berger.

Philippe Berger 1891
Title: Histoire de l'écriture dans l'antiquité.
Main Author: Berger, Philippe, 1846-1912.
Published: Paris : Imprimerie nationale, 1891.

"The Sanskrit alphabet does not present itself in a very simple
manner in the practice of writing. The process by which we have
found the principle in Indo-Bacterian, and which consisted of
suspending the letters one from another in order to express complex
sounds, develops in Devanagari. Not only is the short a not written
either in the middle or the end of words, since it is inherent in
the consonant, but the other vowels are replaced, within the words,
by signs which differ from the full form.

The short i becomes … and precedes the consonant in writing,
although it follows it in pronunciation. The four medial vowels …
aa, … ii, … oo and … au place themselves after the consonant, six
others attach themselves to the bottom of the consonant: … u, …. ou,
… ri, … rii, … lri, … lrii, two, … ee and … aa are placed above.
Finally, the consonants attach themselves to each other in such a
way as to form groups, the number of which rises to more than 800."

I have substituted Berger's writing of the vowels with a double
vowel system to indicate long vowels. Berger used the macron, breve,
acute, circumflex and umlaut to mark vowel quality. Each Devnagari
vowel notation was also represented following the transliteration.
He supplied the Devanagari vowel where I have put ... (Of course, I
won't attempt to put Devnagari in here because I am afraid it will
come out as Chinese!)

> > I am back again to wondering what you meant when you said
> >
> > "But these terms misleadingly suggest that the abugida is a

subtype

> > or hybrid of alphabet or syllabary, a notion that has lead to
> > unfortunate historical/evolutionary notions about the history of
> > writing." WWS p.4
> >
> > I have been reading writing system theory from a different
> > perspective and I am not at all sure what you intend here.
> > Particularly 'misleadingly' 'unfortunate' and 'evolutionary'.
>
> They have the morpheme "syllab" in them.

Why were the evolutionary notions so unfortunate? I know why _I_
find them unfortunate but you seem to have other reasons.

> > > I'll see the History of Writing tomorrow
> >
> > I hope you got to see it - I'll have to wait a while, the

reference

> > library at UBC closes at 5:00 during spring hours.
>
> Don't bother!

I only mentioned Smith Williams as an example of the powerful
connection between the alphabet and mass literacy. In fact, the
breaking of this association is so recent that it has lead Robert
Logan to revise his book "The Alphabet Effect", 1987, and write a
second edition in 2003 to include phonetic syllabaries in with
alphabets. (Now I ask you please not to jump on me for reading such
a book. I do have to keep in touch with the shenanigans of the
Toronto School once in a while.)

Suzanne