Re: Delayed messages (sorry!)

Richard Wordingham wrote:

> --- In phoNet@yahoogroups.com, "alex" <alxmoeller@t...> wrote:
>> Some examples appears to be something in the Midle Age if
>> one thinks that Alb. "doktuer" is seen as a loan from
> Latin "doctore".
>> Beside of this , the Latin group "pt" shows two treatments in two
>> words: captiare > kapshoy
>
> -pti- (i became a consonant) is different to -pt-, as -pt- is
> different to -p-.

in which language then? So far I remember Rom. does not show an
different treatment of "p", "pt" & "pti".
The only differnec by "pti" is "pti" >"pTi" due affricatisation of "t".

>
>> discaptare > diktoj
>
> But what did we get here as an intermediate stage. -skpt-? No
> wonder the development of the whole is not the sum of the
> development of the parts! Moreover, at such a point, -pt- has
> ceased to be an intervocalic cluster!

it seems that here "p" got lost at all and one does not have no "pt"
anymore. You pointed an interesting thing which ought to be compared. I
will make in evening a scan in my database( I hope I have the time)

>
>> Now to Rom. Lang. The "kt" group is seen not just as regular "pt" but
>> too as "t" in words as "unt" < unctum", "untura" > unctura".
>
> We discussed this sort of development of -nct-, in relationship to
> the development of Latin _sanctus_, on Cybalist in
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/23333 and its thread.

We discussed about a false problem since Miguel pointed out there was no
"nct" > "nt" but "nt" > nt" due the Vulgar Latin form of "sanctus" was
"santu"

>
>> Interesting aspect :
>> -it ought to mention something very strange. Albanian share with Rom.
>> almost 100 substratual words, but just 39 Latin words; the rest of
>> Latin words are shared by Albanian with the rest of Romance. How is
>> that to explain ?
>
> Why is that a problem? If Romance had more independent branches,
> there'd be even fewer Latin words surviving only in Romanian and
> Albanian.
>
> Richard.

The problem is the location of PRom in the neighbourhood of Albanians.
It appears unlikely that they are living in the same region, share
exclusive substratual words in a big amount but they share just a few
Latin words exclusive.
With Dalmatian, Albanian shares a lot of Latin words which are not known
in Rom.
I remember about Piotr wanting to put its money in a region what should
be today Macedonia for PRom; not that I want him loose his money but the
linguistic evidence appears very very weak (if not doubtfully at all)
for a such placement.

Alex