----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert B Wilson" <han_solo55@...>
To: <phoNet@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: [phoNet] Abstractness (Was Re: [j] v. [i])

> > > How do you pronounce 'top', 'bomb', 'calm', 'talk',
> > > 'walk', 'horse' and 'hoarse'?
> i pronounce these as [t_hOp_}], [bO:m], [k_hA5m], [t_hA5k_}], [wA5k_}],
> [hOr\s], and [hOr\s], and i speak what i consider to be standard north
> american english...

Isn't sounding the <l> is non-standard? I put 'talk' and 'walk' on the list
because in some non-rhotic English dialects (Tyneside to be precise) 'al'
represents a different vowel ([a], I'm not sure of length) to the one
represented by both 'ar' in 'farm' and 'al' in 'calm' and to the one
represented by 'or' in 'fork'. (In RP monosyllables, 'alm' is pronouced
[A:m], i.e. exactly as 'arm'.) Alas, I don't know how the vowel of 'bought'
fits in.

It looks as though the Ossetian problem with aesc (æ) is indeed a matter of
8-bit encoding. When an 8-bit e-mail specifies its encoding, aesc comes
through OK. My computer's recently been used to e-mail in Thai, and in
Robert's e-mail, which didn't specify the encoding, the aesc has been
interpreted as the Thai symbol with the same 8-bit code.

> i'd suggest using something else for the shwa, as & is commonly used for
> ๆ. perhaps *?

In SAMPA, [&] represents the front, open, round vowel, denoted by the OE
ligature. Perhaps we should shift to '&\' for schwa, as this combination
has not been assigned a value in Extended SAMPA. '*' is reserved by SAMPA
for use as a 'conjunctor', but apparently it is not sure what that means!
On the other hand, the RP vowel of 'bad' is now recorded by the OED as [a]
rather than [{].

> "They are not in Baghdad. They are not in control of any airport. I
> tell you this. It is all a lie. They lie. It is a hollywood movie.
> You do not believe them."
> -- Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf, Iraqi Minister of Information

Well, I hear that Hollywod did a good job on the moon landings, with only
the lighting letting them down. War movies are a dime a dozen. :-)