Re: is rett_thiele signed up?

Hi Amara,

> I've asked my friend to bring you a complete list of the Pali
grammar
> books in the Mahamakut Bookstore, if I'm not mistaken they also have
> an order form with the address.  I will snailmail the list to you
> unless you want me to translate it and email it to you when I get
it.

That's sounds great! Just keep the list for now when you get it. I'd
like you to look through the list to see if there are any books I'm
interested in. I'd like the Kaccayana book that Num referred to late
last spring.

> Could you please elaborate a little about 'the full text in Pali',
> does this mean that the teachings/explanations in Paali and not
Thai?
>  Or just the Paali excercise to be translated?  I rather doubt the
> Thais have Pali lessons explained in Paali, I have only ever heard
of
> Pali rapidly translated into Thai and vise versa, but not
explanations
> done in Pali also, at least not in conversations I have attended.

What I'm interested in are old classical Pali texts on the Pali
language like the Kaccaayanavyaakara.na. Most of them were written
many centuries ago. These kinds of texts can be seen in the
byaakara.na-gantha-sangaha section on the CSCD disk. I'm not
interested in Pali exercise books intended for Thai speakers.

> Pali grammar books printed by the Mahamakut is mainly for bhikkhus
> studying the Pali as opposed to the dhamma in Thai, they come in
> several levels called 'Parien 1-9' listed in this page
>
> The lower half of the page with the numbers 1-9 at the end are the
> different levels and aspects of Pali required for the student to
pass
> the exams of each level.
>
> Other Pali grammar books are listed separately, and generally not
> included in the website.  I will send you the list or translate the
> list for you if you wish, meanwhile perhaps you would like to browse
> the site, which also lists some books in English, although I didn't
> see the Kaccayana.

Thanks for the link but I can't read it just yet. The words seem to be
Thai rather than Pali because of the extra markings above the letters
that aren't seen in Pali which I think only has two of these markings.

I have a printed Burmese copy of Kaccayana's grammar where on the back
(in Burmese script) there is a list of 10 grammar books for sale:
Kaccayanavyakarana, Rupasiddhi, a Tika on the latter, Saddaniti (3
vols), the nissaya on the latter (3 vols), Niruttidipani, and
Payogasiddhi. Now when I look at a list like this, I see that I have
the first two. I would therefore be interested in getting the rest
except for the Burmese Nissaya which I wouldn't be able to read. So
when you get the list look to see if there are any similar books plus
any with the name Moggallana who is another well-known grammarian.
Besides these, there are many others I'm interested in as well. Others
to look for are the Abhidhanappadipika and commentaries on Kaccayana's
grammar.

[...]

> Personally I believe that we can study the dhamma in any
> languge, as long as they are correctly translated, which is why I
> still value those with Pali learning very greatly, but less than I
do
> the dhamma as applied in daily life of course.  I think the more
Pali
> scholars we have the more chance of having correctly translated
books,
> which would be invaluable, such as in the case of the Thai scholars,
> these texts have been translated over and over for centuries, and
when
> the language had mutated, others would add their scholarship to try
to
> keep the meanings according to the original Pali as much as
possible.
>  Which doesn't mean that there hasn't been any changes, but the
texts
> are still comprehensible to dhamma students, in spite of the extreme
> difficulty of the subject matter.  Of course this is just my
opinion,

Thank you for the info and expressing your opinion which differs from
mine. I find it so much more preferrable to read and study the Pali
texts in the original language rather than in their translations which
are more prone to misinterpreting. Of course, most people do not have
the time and inclination to devote a big chunk of their life to the
study of Pali, so reading translations of the Buddhavacana is
certainly a lot better than nothing.

> > If you like, you could scan the pictures and upload them to the
photo
> > section. I'd also be interested in seeing pictures of Thai
calligraphy
> > of Pali words or passages.

> The first is a 'transcript' from the stone, the second a carving of
> the first sermon Indian style which is quite different from the Thai
> images.  The third is the original stone with the inscription, now
> displayed at the local museum.

Thank you for the pictures which I have looked at. I find the script
very interesting and would like to go back and study it in more detail
as some of the characters looked familiar to me.

Thanks for your great response and help!

Best wishes,
Jim