Re: pali, pali and pali

Dear Jim,

Many thanks for this response...I'm sorry some of my questions
were not very clear (and simple was not so simple), but you've
answered anyway. I had not appreciated before that there may
be sentences or more in some manuscripst and not others but
I'm glad to hear that in most cases the differences are minor. I
will take more note of this area in translator's introductions now.

thanks very much to you & Teng kee.

I look f/w to more on 'jhaayii', but no hurry at all.

in a rush,
Sarah

--- In palistudy@..., "Jim Anderson" <jimanderson_on@...>
wrote:
> Dear Sarah,
>
> >Dear Jim and other Pali scholars,
> >
> >I have a simple question which will show up my complete
> >ignorance in this area.
>
> Your simple question turns out to be not so simple!!!
>
> >Would you kindly explain to me, in brief, what are the
differences
> >between different pali systems and which is considered to be
> >the most authentic?
>
> I'm not sure if I understand what you mean by 'pali systems'.
What comes to
> my mind are the different spelling conventions (orthographies)
used. For
> example, some texts show a preference for double
consonants instead of a
> single one like the 'ss' in 'aanaapaanassati' instead of just a
single 's'
> as in 'aanaapaanasati'. I couldn't tell you which is the more
authentic form
> but I find myself having a preference for the first way of spelling
because
> such doubling helps one to determine the corresponding
Sanskrit form
> which can clarify the ambiguity of some Pali homonyms. Skt.
'smr.ti' with
> the two initial consonants 'sm-' corresponds to '-ss-' in the Pali
compound.
> Also note the doubling in 'anussati' (anu + sati) whereas 
'anusati' is
> unusual.
>
> >I understand that  the Singhalese pali canon, for example,
> >maybe different from the Burmese or Thai pali canon, not just
in
> >script (of course!) but in some of the words used. Is this
right?
>
> Yes. And I think you would also find many differences among
the different
> editions within each country and between different palm leaf
manuscripts.
> And the same would apply to older and newer editions of the
PTS. The
> differences are, for the most part, orthographic and minor. But
there are
> occasionally significant differences involving different words,
omissions,
> and possible insertions. Sometimes a whole sentence might
occur in one canon
> but be absent in another which can be problematic -- one
doesn't not know
> for sure whether the sentence in question got lost, or was
deliberately
> left out or put in.
>
> >How many different pali canons are there and which ones are
> >mostly used by translators? How significant are these
> >differences? Perhaps there is just an article you can refer me
to -
> >(I vaguely remember B.Bodhi discussing it in an intro.
> >somewhere)
>
> I couldn't tell you how many different pali canons there are.
You'd have to
> be specific about what you mean by 'pali canon'. Perhaps you
mean complete
> printed sets of the Pali Tipitaka. But this set could be a loose
one like
> the volumes prepared by individual editors for the PTS over the
course of
> decades and not printed as a unit like a set of encyclopedia. It
probably
> isn't necessary for a translator to have the entire pali canon in
order to
> translate one or two volumes of it. I think most serious
translators in the
> West would make use of as many different editions as they
could get their
> hands on and all of them would likely have a PTS ed. of the text
they're
> translating. You can often find out which texts the translator
based his/her
> work on in the preface or introduction. Eg. from a glance at the
beginning
> of Vol. I of Horner's MLS, the PTS ed. of the Pali text is the one
she used
> for her translation and no other ed. is mentioned but she also
made use of
> the MA commentary and two other translations to help her.
>
> Nowadays with easier access to Pali canons online and on
> cd-roms, the translator has more to work with. Personally, I
think a
> translator should consult at least three different versions of the
text
> being translated and to follow very carefully the commentaries
pertaining
> to it. I have access to 5 sets of the tipitaka, 3 sets of the
atthakatha
> commentaries, and 1 or 2 sets of the tikas plus most of the
translations
> published by PTS. For some of the texts being translated on
psg I have
> been including some readings that are significantly different.
The long
> commentarial passages that Nina has been translating are
from the Burmese
> Chatthasangayana ed. on the cd-rom disk. It is much easier for
me to copy
> and paste from this disk than having to manually type out every
word from
> the PTS ed. and it's too inconvenient and time-consuming to
copy and paste
> passages from the Thai Budsir disk but I can at least check for
significant
> differences in their readings.
>
> I think a good place to find more information on translation
work are in
> the prefaces and introductions of translators' works.
>
> I have gathered up some information on 'jhaayii' (meditator)
which I will
> post as soon as I get the documentation together. 'jhaayii' also
includes
> the one developing vipassanaa much like the way 'jhaayatha'
(meditate)
> includes vipassanaa practice.
>
> Best wishes,
> Jim
>
>
>
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