Re: pa~n~naavuddhisutta.m

Dear Amara,

>I think I understand the sutta's meaning because I have seen the
>translation, at least in Thai, and recognize most of the Pali terms,
>although I wouldn't know how to explain the grammar or structure.  For
>example I can guess that 'cattaaro' has to do with the number 4, but
>what is 'cattaaro'me'?  Does the 'me' part here have anything to do
>with the 'katame' in the question?  Or the 'ime kho' in the next
>sentence?

I've already explained cattaaro'me so I won't say anymore here. katame and
ime belong to the same group called 'sabbanaama-s' which consist mostly of
pronouns. The 'me and the ime in the last sentence are both exactly the same
word and used in exactly the same way except for the word-order.

>My guess:
>> pa~n~naavuddhisutta.m.
>The development of panna

I usually read 'development' as a translation of 'bhaavanaa'. In the Pa.tis
com. I found va.d.dhana as a synonym of bhaavanaa. Va.d.dhana, va.d.dhi, and
vuddhi all have similar meanings and that might support 'development' as a
translation of 'vuddhi' if we think of it this way.

>> cattaaro'me bhikkhave dhammaa pa~n~naavuddhiyaa sa.mvattanti. katame
>Four dhamma develop panna of the bhikkhu who observe them.  What

'of the bhikkhu who observe them' is incorrect for "me bhikkhave". Also,
you've shifted 'develop' to the verb 'sa.mvattanti' which has a different
meaning. A more consistent translation would have been:" Bhikkhus, these
four dhammas lead to the development of pa~n~naa."

>> cattaaro? sappurisasa.msevo, saddhammasavana.m, yoniso manasikaaro,
>four?  To associate with the sappurisa, to listen to the saddhamma,
>wise consideration/analysis,
>
>> dhammaanudhammapa.tipatti. ime kho bhikkhave cattaaro dhammaa
>practice(/reach particularly) the dhamma according to the dhamma.
>These four dhamma
>
>> pa~n~naavuddhiyaa sa.mvattantiiti. (A ii 245)
>develop the panna of the bhikkhu who observe them.
>
>Most of it is just according to the Thai version if I remember it
>correctly!  So this might be a bit unfair!

Would you be interested in translating the Thai translation of this sutta
into English for us to compare? It can be found in nipaata 4, aapattivagga.

Best wishes,
Jim


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