Re: Pali Word by Word 2003/11 [005]

Dear Nina, Rene and friends,

thanks.

1. bhava (m.) the state of existence.

Previously, you have written:
bhava is birth and this pertains to the foregoing: .. no reproach
in respect to birth.

bhava~nhi? I can't figure out what form the word takes. And, how do I
put it nicely into the sentence? Can I put it this way:
(With) no reproach in respect to birth, Sonadana (was) prosperous,
well to do and rich.

2. It isn't my intention to pick such hard sentences. I thought this
would be an easy one, and Sigalovada Sutta does not have many vaa to
choose from. With your assistance, I realise that the full verse have
to go together for a complete sentence. So,

"Ete ca sa"ngahaa naassu, na maataa puttakaara.naa; <<<is semi-colon
redundant?

labhetha maana.m puuja.m vaa, pitaa vaa puttakaara.naa.

Can I say that because of metrical requirement, the text is
rearranged in a non-standard form? If so, would it be something like
this in prose:

"Ete ca sa"ngahaa naassu, na maataa vaa pitaa vaa puttakaara.naa
labhetha maana.m puuja.m.

"And not/without these (kind) treatments, no mother or father will
receive honour and respect from child.

ete (m.pl. from etad) these.
sa"ngaha (m.) treatment.
naassu ??? (interrogative) not. ??? without
maatar (f.) mother
putta (m.) son.
kaara.naa ??? (abl.) from
puttakaara.naa - ??? from son/child
labhetha (labhati 3rd sing. opt.) (will) get, receive.
maana (1) pride, conceit, arrogance; (2) honour, respect.
puujaa (f.) honour, worship.
maanapuujaa honour and respect. [see PED maana2]
pitar (m.) father.


metta,
Yong Peng

--- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, nina van gorkom wrote:
> As to the previous Word by word: "Bhava~nhi so.nada.n.do a.d.dho
mahaddhano mahaabhogo pe", I find iot difficult to fit in here a
greeting bhava~nhi, also the hi. I am inclined to take it as
referring to his birth in a previous sentence, when I look at the
whole sutta.


> I just take sentence no 3, for now.
> >
> > (3) DN31 Sigalovada Sutta CSCD273/PTS3.192
> > Labhetha maana.m puuja.m vaa, pitaa vaa puttakaara.naa.
> >
> > labhetha (labhati 3rd sing. opt.) (will) get, receive.
> > maana (1) pride, conceit, arrogance; (2) honour, respect.
> > puujaa (f.) honour, worship.
> > maanapuujaa honour and respect. [see PED maana2]
> > pitar father
> > putta (m.) son.
> > kaara.naa (n.) cause.
> > puttakaara.naa - ???
> N: The abl kaara.naa : by means of, through.
> The PTS transl the verse:
> <And if these things be not, no mother reaps
> The honour and respect her child should pay,
> Nor does the father win them through the child>
> The previous verses explain about the kindness, helpfulness etc.
there should be.
> The Commentary:
> <Na maataa putta-kaara.naa ti. yadi maataa ete sa"ngahe puttassa na
kareyya, putta-kaara.naa maana.m vaa puuja.m na labheyya.
>
> The mother does not through the child, means, if (yadi) the mother
does not do these kind acts (ete sa"ngahe), for the child, she may
not receive honour and respect from her child.
>
> Sa"ngahe ete ti.
> These kind acts.
> upayoga-vacane paccatta.m.
> seperately (paccatta.m) in the textual (vacane) application.
> Sa"ngahe ete ti vaa paa.tho
> The words sa"ngahe ete, these kind acts, or the passage of the text
> (paa.tho).
> Remark: The words ete sa"ngahe, seem to refer to the previous: all
the kind acts people should perform. One of the meanings given in
PED. Bases of popularity. I would like other opinions, please. The
word vaa before paa.tho is not clear to me.