Re: pottus, Genua, Durantia (was: Bart; was: Ligurian)

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@...> wrote:

>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Bhrihskwobhloukstroy <bhrihstlobhrouzghdhroy@> wrote:
> >
> > 2012/6/7, dgkilday57 <dgkilday57@>:
> > >
> > > [...]
> > >
> > > DGK:
> > > Regarding a non-Celtic innovation, I believe we have one in Genua, Lig.
> > > *Genua:, from *genewa: or *genowa: '(town) on the corner (of the Ligurian
> > > Sea)', PIE *g^enu- 'corner, angle; knee; jaw'. That is, before *-wa(:)- a
> > > SHORT vowel is lost with subsequent vocalization of */w/ to /u/. (Gena:va
> > > has a LONG vowel and a different formation, along with Fundus Gena(:)via of
> > > course.)
> >
> > Bhrihskwobhloukstroy:
> >
> > Be careful please: Latin <Genua> > Tuscan Genova (like Mantua >
> > Mantova and other instances of -ua < *-owa:) is to be read ['gÉnuwa]
> > (otherwise it would have yielded Tuscan â Genva, Genoese â Zeva) and has
> > non-stressed */o/ > /u/ raising in open syllable before /w/, so the
> > Ligurian form must have been *Genowa: exatcly what You have written
> > before (i.e. without) any supposedly Ligurian non-Celtic innovation.
> > Gena:ua is of course a different formation, a vrddhi one:
> > *G'enh1/2o:wah2 (*h1 or *h2 according to the etymology: *g'enh1- if
> > 'Natives' place', *g'enh2- if 'Corner' ('Knee') or 'Mouth' ('Jaw'))
>
> I used to agree with Lig. *Genowa: based on the earliest Greek form, but I no longer find it necessary, and I believe I can answer your other objections in a few days (why Gen. Zena, etc.).

Tuscan is not Old French, where we do find -v- from atonic prevocalic -u- in <anvel> 'annual', <Janvier>, <Jenvier> 'January' (for *Jenu- cf. Tusc. <gennaio>, Spanish <Enero>). Instead Latin <cornua>, <carduus> yield Tusc. <corna> 'horns of animals', <cardo> 'thistle', so atonic -u- is lost in this position. (Tusc. <annuo> 'annual', <arduo> 'arduous', and the like are obviously learned borrowings, not inherited.) Tusc. <garÃ²fano> 'clove-pink, Dianthus caryophyllus', with ending-substitution (cf. Venetian <garÃ²folo>, Friulian <garÃ²ful>) from Greek <karuÃ³phullon>, shows that pretonic prevocalic -u- was lost as well as posttonic.

Tusc. <Genova>, against the expected *Gena (cf. Genovese <Zena>), must come from a different dialect. English <Genoa> apparently comes from Old ProvenÃ§al (cf. OProv <anoal> '(annual) service for the dead'). Now, literary OProv has merged the reflexes of *-ua-, *-uba-, and *-uva- into -oa-, but perhaps early (preliterary) OProv had *-ova-, and this *Genova was borrowed into Old Tuscan. The alternative source of <Genova> is a dialect of NE Italy, where <Padova> is regular for *Padua (identical to the name of a mouth of the Po, Catull. 95:7; cf. Polyb. 2:16; Lat. <Patavium> evidently comes from the archaic Etruscan form) and we have Old Friul. <innoval> 'birthday' (i.e. <annua:lis> sc. <die:s>) and the like.

Grk. <aphÃºe:> 'anchovy' acquired a glide in Lat. <apyia> (CGL) and underwent further deformation and contamination in Romance. Spanish <ancho(v)a>, Catalan <amploia>, Nizzese <amplova>, and Genovese <anc^ova> apparently continue *ampluva, resulting from <amplus> (the fish congregates in ample numbers) crossing with *apiuva, a Vulgar Latin adaptation of <apyia> (or crossing in turn with <apis>, since the schools of fish resemble swarms of bees). The treatment of the ending in Genovese makes it highly unlikely that Lat. <Genua> was locally pronounced *Genuva. The glide would have protected the atonic -u- and we would expect Gen. *Zenova, not <Zena>.

DGK