2012/6/1, dgkilday57 <
dgkilday57@...>:
>
>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Tavi" <oalexandre@...> wrote:
>>
>> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@> wrote:
>> >
>
>> > Of course, if you belong to the Super Mario Brothers, there was no
>> breakup, no diaspora, and everybody was polite to everybody else until
>> Romulus slew Remus over a perceived insult.
>> >
>> You remind me of a cartoon quoted by Renfrew where Caesar's soldiers
>> were drinking beer and smoking cigarrettes at a café. Hint: these
>> things were introduced at a later date but yet they've got common words
>> in Romance languages.
>
> Colin Renfrew is much closer to Super Mario Alinei than I am. My whole
> stock in trade is linguistic stratification. The Super Mario doctrine holds
> that there was only one pre-Roman substrate (at least in IE-speaking Western
> Europe), hence no stratification of Gaulish on Ligurian or whatever. It is
> remarkable how well this doctrine fits with the ideology of the Northern
> Italian separatist movement, whose mantra is "Roma Padrona e Ladrona" or
> something. But then, scholars never allow themselves to be sullied by
> political ideology, do they?
>
Bhrihskwobhloukstroy:
If You are interested in political backgrounds of different
linguistic reconstruction theories, I have noted what follows:
1) Northern Italian Separatists are divided into three frames:
a) Nazi-like supporters of recent IE invasionism against Mediterranean enemies;
b) Third-World-friendly fighters for Independence against Roman
Colonialism and therefore supporters of Pre-IE substrates (ergo recent
IE invasionism again, although without any sympathy for
Indo-Europeans)
c) local continuity from PIE (first peopling) to Celtic (ergo
Palaeolithic Continuism) and, subsequently, heavy Celtic substrate
resistence against Latin superimposition
2) residual National-Socialist élite groups are in turn split into:
a) supporters of recent IE invasionism against Mediterranean enemies (like 1a)
b) supporters of Palaeolithic Continuity against very late Roman
Rassenchaos (like 1c)
3) Fascists and Right-Wing Clericals are both supporters of
anti-Indo-European Mediterranean Civilizations (explicitly
Hamito-Semitic for Clericals), ergo recent IE invasionism again
(although without any sympathy for Indo-Europeans; like 1b)
4) Masonic Lodges and their social media tend to converge on a
'Western USA Model' of European Prehistory, i.e. recent IE invasionism
(upon non-IE substrates) and self-identification with Indo-Europeans
(like 1a and 2a)
5) Leftist are again split into:
a) Marxian-Engelsian Evolutionary Orthodoxy (recent IE invasion as
pastoralist improvement upon preceding agriculturalist non-IE
Mediterranean substrates; surprisingly similar to 1a and 2a)
b) Third-World-friendly No-Global supporters of ancient Mediterranean
peoples as oppressed by recent IE newcomers (like 1b and, although
with a completely different political agenda, 3)
c) Conservative Pacifists against every war and invasion and therefore
inclined to Palaeolithic IE continuism.
I have to make it clear that Mario Alinei, notwithstanding with his
rôle of leading continuist (and of his Hungarian Extreme Right
supporters), belongs to category n° 4a; his theory is fundamentally
different from 1c, 2b, and 5c because he denies any importance to PIE
in Europe (PIE would have never been spoken in Europe) and in general
to Proto-Languages, while he back-dates 'recent' post-PIE languages
like Latin and modern languages in general (even Old Hungarian, as the
language of the Etruscans).
To sum up, Recent IE Invasionism is common to (from Right to Left):
- the Racist half of the Nazis (2a)
- the Nazi-like third of Northern Italian Separatists (1a)
- Masonic Propaganda (4)
- pre-Leninist Marxists (5a)
but also to Anti-Indo-Europeanists:
- Fascists and Clericals (3)
- the Anti-Colonialist third of Northern Italian Separatists (1b)
- Leftist No-Globals (5b)
while Palaeolithic IE Continuity Theory (different from Alinei's
Palaeolithic Modern Languages Continuity Theory) is common to:
- the Imperialist half of the Nazis (2b)
- the Celticist third of Northern Italian Separatists (1c)
- Conservative Pacifists (5c)