>That was because I agree.
Aha, I see: qui tacet consentire videtur
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bastarnae
>'inhabited the region between the eastern Carpathian mountains and
>the Dnieper river (corresponding to the modern Republic of Moldova
>and western part of southern Ukraine)'.
I know. We had this in school, when Wikipedia's father (Jimbo)
was 3 or 4 years old.
>That means they controlled the land up river from the Greek Black
>Sea cities. Some of them would have moved there, settled and
>learned the Bastarnian / Old High German language.
Yeah, sure: they learned a kind of Deutsch that evolved 1,100 to
1,500 years later on. :)
>Compare the standard explanation:
>
>Jews lived in Eastern Europe, having adopted Slavic as their
>language. Suddenly Germans arrived from Germany on a rampage,
>subjugating the natives. The Jews became so infatuated with
>them that they all decided to communicate in a German dialect,
>even if they were hundreds of miles away from any German,
>thus suddenly rendering communication impossible with
>their neighbors, the Slavs.
>
>Which do you prefer?
I prefer the most plausible story. And this one is the story of
the German colonisation with peasants and "Bürger" in Eastern
Europe. That's where Ashkenazic Jews (who chiefly spoke Crimean
Turkic, and then Slavic as a 2nd language) got in touch with the
German language towards the middle of the 2nd millenium CE. They
learnt it as a "lingua franca" of the medieval Eastern Europe,
spoken by German traders & farmers, as well as by Jews immigrated
from the "Reich" (which is also onomastically shown: Dreyfus =
from Trier, Schapira/Schapiro = from Speyer, Halperin = from
Heilbronn, Ginsburg = from Günzburg, Lifschitz/Lipshitz = from
Löbschütz etc.) Remember: Yiddish is a German variant that
already went through all sound shifts. The only German in the
same area, that missed some shifts is the one spoken by the
German minority of Romania called the Transylvanian Saxons, whose
ancestors moved from the Trier and Luxemburg area and is a kind
of Low and Middle German mixture - after 1700 heavily influenced
in the vocabulary by Austrian Bavarian, since between circa 1700
and 1918 Transylvania was an Austrian province, along with
Moldova's northern part called Bucovina, since the 1730s. Although
influenced by this South-German Oberdeutsch, Transylvanian
Saxons' dialects have kept their numerous features that show
their provenance from a MHG kind of German, in contrast with
Yiddish: Yiddish is always called "a Mittelhochdeutsch" idiom,
but in reality it has all features of a... "Neuhochdeutsch" as
the rest of today's German dialects south of Frankfurt. A linguist
to ignore such major elements is... Well, no wonder that your
imagination trys establishing such impossible nexuses, and that
you aren't bothered by such enormous chronological gaps between
different epochs.).
>See above!!!
Come on, don't kid me, in those Bosporan kingdom times there
were no Deutsche-Sprache-speaking people and no Jiddische-
Sprache-speaking people. In those times, there were no Romanian-
speaking people, and nobody was parlando la lingua italiana,
nor was able to parle français. These modern languages were
in their proto-proto-inception as early as in the 8th-9th-10th
centuries, whereas the events you always try to put in connections
with them occurred 8 to 11 centuries earlier (in the case of
the Jiddische Losch'n even 14-15 centuries earlier).
>BTW, you shouldn't talk that way of the
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosporan_kingdom
>the other George liked it very much.
Your (and only your) problem is that you won't and can't infer
any conclusion regarding possibilities and plausibilities from
the fact that you compare completely different historic epochs,
you neglect the obstacles of linguistic history (exactly those
sound shift "laws" you invoke in other contexts), and that
no vivid popular language can stay virtually unchanged thousand
years, even if there is a "French Academy" to pay attention how
the vulgus talks and writes. :)
To talk of Deutsche Sprache in the era of the Bastarnians and
of the Romanian language having its inception in the 1st
century BCE means... blunder for anyone, let alone for a linguist
and a historian. By the same "1st c. BCE" token, why is not
the inception of the Romanian language ab urbe condita or in
the PIE era when PIE peoples moved around the Caucasus ranges
and around the Caspian and Black seas? Why not even earlier,
in the era soon after "outa Africa"? :)
>>This cult wasn't a Caananite one, but a PIE one. At that,
>>a ... mounted one!
>
>Yes, and? Any worse than a golden calf?
If you're not able to see what fits and what doesn't...
>>Ashkenazi Jews's origins are Scythian, Balto-Slavic,
>>Turkic (Tatar) and Iranian.
>
>Oh, you are one of those who believe that ...
I don't believe, I learn and take into consideration presentations
and hypotheses that tend to be plausible (whose "markers" and
proofs are OK, not mere ... tales).
>Well, genetics say different:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_on_Jews#Y-DNA_of_Ashkenazi_Jews
Rad carefully the whole stuff there and have an attentive look
at the diagrams and tables. You'll see even there, in the
wikipedia articles (look up those about the R1a, R1b and J1
haploids), that the "typical (?)" Middle East haploids values
show a pretty scarce frequency in the Ashkenasic population,
whereas the common heritage of the east-European PIE peoples
is almost as much there as in any other neighboring non-Jewish
population. And you'll also see that the so-called Y chromosome
of the Moses-Aaron brethren is highly there in the Kurdish
and adjacent populations in and around Eastern Anatolia (Kurdistan).
Genetic studies rather confirm linguistics and history, namely
that Eastern European Jews are by and large continuators of
Cimmerian, Scythian (Iranian), Tocharian, Uralic-language speakers, Turkic-language speakers (esp. Oguric) and East-Slavic-language
speakers from among populations that converted to the Mozaic
faith after the 8th century (when the Khazar dynasty from
among the "royal" Dulo clan decided so). (Also possible that
some Crimean Gothic and Scandinavian Varangian individuals
were assimilated too in the east-Eur. Jewry - plausible.)