Re: Magyar uveg <-> Romanian uiag&

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@...>
wrote:

>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@> wrote:
> >
> > On 2008-04-21 20:58, david_russell_watson wrote:
> >
> > > Johnny Cheung gives:
> > >
> > > avg | avgæ 'steklo', 'butylka' ('glass', 'bottle').
> > > < *a:p(a)ka:; cf. M. yówGa, Y. yóuGo 'water' (< *a:paka:-,
> > > IIFL II: 272), W. yupk, (?) yápak, Zaz. awke (f.!) 'water'
> > > (Malmisanij 1987: 26b), MP a:bge:nag 'crystal, glass'
> > > (borrowed in Sogd. ''pkyn-, ''pkyn'k, (Man.) ''pky(nyy)
> > > '?'), Khz. 'bkyn(n)k 'glass'.
> >
> > Of course the root is IIr. *a(:)p- 'water' with the all-purpose
> suffix
> > *-aka-, so 'glass' = 'water-like'.
> >
> > Piotr
> >
>
>
> I. The Romanian word is ujag& 'bottle, (glass)'
>
> II. The word is considered a loan from Hung. uveg 'id.'
>
> III. But I 'cannot stop' myself not to link Romanian
> uiag~a /ujag&/ 'bottle, (glass)' with Albanian /uj&/ 'water'.
>
> A similar formation is present in Romanian /desag&/ 'bag, sack' a
> Balkanic word presents also in Bulgarian and Greek.
>
> Next Albanian uj& 'water' is considered to in linked also with
> Romanian noian 'imense waters' (Rosetti, Hasdeu)
>
>
> IV. Also, I cannot see also how an Ossetic /a/ (avg < *a(:)paka:)

can

> be loaned in Hungarian as /ü/
>
> Taking Abaev's List
> ----------------------------------------------------
> Osset. arg "price" - Hung. ár "price", alku "trade";
> Osset. avg "glass" - Hung. üveg "glass";
> Osset. ävzist "silver" - Hung. ezüst "silver";
> Osset. bud "smell" - Hung. büz "stench";
> Osset. käsag "fish" - Hung. keszeg "bream";
> Osset. marg "poison" - Hung. mereg "poison";
> Osset. nymät "felt" - Hung. nemez "felt";
> Osset. qád "tree" - Hung. gaz "forest";
> Osset. sak'adax "a sleeve of the river " - Hung. szakdék "gorge";
> Osset. säfyn "to clean" - Hung. seper "to sweep";
> Osset. säv "wide" - Hung. sáv "strip", etc
>
> We see that to an Ossetic a,á correspond Hung. á,a,e
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Osset. arg "price" - Hung. ár "price", alku "trade";
> Osset. käsag "fish" - Hung. keszeg "bream";
> Osset. marg "poison" - Hung. mereg "poison";
> Osset. qád "tree" - Hung. gaz "forest";
> Osset. sak'adax "a sleeve of the river " - Hung. szakdék "gorge";
>
> Also we see that Hung.ü correspond to Ossetic u,i (that is

reasonable)

> --------------------------------------------------------------------

--

> Osset. bud "smell" - Hung. büz "stench";
> Osset. ävzist "silver" - Hung. ezüst "silver";
>
> So an Ossetic a for a Hung ü is completly irregular
> ----------------------------------------------------
> Osset. avg "glass" - Hung. üveg "glass";
>
> Also I couldn't find a Hungarian /ü/ loaned from an /a/ of any

other

> language ...
>
>
> IV. Next Romanian /ujag&/ doesn't have inside the v of üveg
> In addition it has an /y/ not present in the Ossetic form avg <
> (*a(:)paka), word supposed to be the origin of the Hungarian word,

so

> of course /y/ is not/it wasn't present in the Hungarian form, if

from

> Ossetic.
>
> Also Rom. e/accented > ye/ya was ended (->End of Roman Period &

<-

> Before the Slav Arrival in Balkans ), so long before the arrival of
> Hungarians in Pannonia (898 AC), to can be considered here as a
> possible source for the Romanian /y/ in uiag~a if from üveg.
>
> So if I put together üveg with ujag& (it's impossible, of

course,

> to not link each-other) I can easy derived :
>
> Rom. ujag& > OldHung. uj-wa-ga [uj>ü, w>v, a>e] > Hung. ü-ve-g
>
> But I cannot obtain Rom. ujag& from Hungarian üveg (if from
> Ossetic avg < a(:)paka:)
>
> Marius
>

For that ones that want to see how /uiag&/ is pronounced in Romanian,
you can find it in a popular song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVKfmFJCeaU

Marius