From: alexandru_mg3
Message: 57422
Date: 2008-04-15
>like
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@> wrote:
> >
> > On 2008-04-15 23:21, alexandru_mg3 wrote:
> >
> > > There was Piotr here that asserted that there are no trace of
> animals
> > > names in Baltic related to the Germanic marko
> > >
> > > False.
> > >
> > > a) Such names refers to ox, cow, dog in Baltic see
> >
>
> I.> They refer to the colour of animals, not to any particular
> species.
>
> Pure sophism Piotr : the colour is very often associated to
> different species too : see Rom. 'Ursul Brun' : colour brown versus
> Rom. 'Ursul Polar' : colour white
>
> Also I can bet with you that Calul-Murg is a dsitinct type of
> horse.
>
> II.
> Gmc.
> > *marxa-, *marxjo:n- and Celtic *marko- refer to horses (never to
> dogs,
> > oxen, etc.).
>
> In is the same in Romanian : Murgul means ONLY a HORSE
> But it wasn't so in OldRomanian we can find 'oaia murg&' etc..
> in Balticand
>
> III.
> > More specifically, they suggest a horse's function
> > ('saddle-horse'), but never its colour.
>
> No issue here: Once we have identified a specific type of horse
> (having a specific colour too) ...there is no issue to go further
> to identify a specific function done by that specific horseof
>
>
> IV.
> > Also, *m(a)rg- doesn't fit
> > either Celtic or Germanic (there is no "Germanic marko-"), both
> whichμάρκαν Akk. Sg.,
> > seem to derive from a form with *k (or *k^).
> > Piotr
>
>
>
> Pokorny material is the below one:
>
> "Root / lemma: marko-
>
> Meaning: horse
>
> German meaning: `Pferd'
>
> Comments: only kelt. and germ.
>
> Material: Ir. marc, cymr. etc march `horse', gall.
> Marcodurum PN;PIE
>
> ahd. marah, ags. mearh, aisl. marr `horse' (nhd. in Mar-schall, -
> stall),
> fem. ahd. meriha, ags. mīere, aisl. merr, nhd. Mähre.
>
> Maybe alb. (*mahar) magar, gomar `donkey'.
>
> References: WP. II 235.
>
> Page(s): 700
> "
>
> Matasovic:
>
> "Proto-Celtic: *marko- 'horse' [Noun]
>
> Old Irish: marc [o m] (a poetic word)
>
> Middle Welsh: march
>
> Middle Breton: march
>
> Cornish: margh
>
> Gaulish: markan [Acc. s], marcosior 'may I ride' [Verb]
>
> Proto-Indo-European: *marko- (?)
>
> IE cognates: OHG marah
>
> Notes: This word is probably a "Wanderwort" of eastern origin, that
> established itself in Celtic and Germanic alongside the inherited
> word for 'horse', *h1ek'wos (OIr. ech).of
>
> References: LEIA 19f., EIEC 274, Lambert 1994: 63, 125, 167,
> Delamarre 217
> "
>
> "
> Proto-Celtic: *markāko- 'horseman' [Noun]
>
> Old Irish: marcach [o m]
>
> Middle Welsh: marhauc [m] (OW), MW marchawc
>
> Middle Breton: mar(c)hog gl. aequester (OBret.)
>
> Cornish: marrec
>
> See also: *marko- 'horse'
>
> References: LEIA M-20, Falileyev 110
> "
>
> 1. For sure Romanian/Albanian m&gar didn't belongs here
>
> 2. Celtic Marcodurum PN can be better linked Dacian Marcodava
>
> 3. Matasovic:
> "Notes: This word is probably a "Wanderwort" of eastern origin,
> that established itself in Celtic and Germanic alongside the
> inherited PIE word for 'horse', *h1ek'wos (OIr. ech). "
>
>
> 4. I fully agree with what Matasovic writes above.
>
> In addition I will say that the Balkano-Baltic zone is the source
> this horse-word *marg-/*murg- :a
>
> I. The word entered in Celtic with -k- (< *g -> this indicates
> k-language as the Celtic Source (probable a Germanic Eastern-be
> Dialect : this is 'my' Germanic *marko-)
>
> II. and from Celtic the word entered next in West-Nothern-
> Germanic with -k-
>
>
> 5. My opinion:
> The similarity marg-/murg-/mark- 'horse' is too important to
> a simple coincidenceI. The word entered in Celtic with -k- (< *g -> this indicates a
>
> Marius
>
> k-language as the Celtic Source (probable a Germanic Eastern-And I think that the missing link I mean the Germanic *marko is
> Dialect : this is 'my' Germanic *marko-)
>