Hachmann versus Kossack?

From: george knysh
Message: 56782
Date: 2008-04-05

I've just re-read the various items Torsten graciously
translated for us. It would seem to me that:

(1) Both writers implicitly agree that Elbe-Germanic
is the name of the archaeological culture which
evolved in the Elbe river basin during the
"transitional" period of the first century BCE, out of
the previous Jastorf culture, which it replaced.

(2) Hachmann contends that this EG cult. pushed
westward from the Weser to the Rhine in the course of
the 1rst c. BCE (accompanied by Przeworsk associates),
and that many traces of it were already available in
situ east of the Rhine by the turn of the millennium.
He identifies EG with the Suebi and Przew. with the
Lugii.

(3) Kossack agrees with the notion that this push
(verified in the historical data) was real, and
continuous, but he thinks that, for EG at least, its
firm and permanent traces west of the Weser are not
available until after the withdrawal of the Roman
legions to the Rhine in the late second decade of the
first c. CE.

So maybe there isn't too much of a disagreement after
all in important issues, just a matter of emphasis.
Hachmann is readier to admit the fundamentally Celtic
nature of the "south of the Lippe" populations in the
transitional period than Kossack.

Attention can now be transferred to the problem which
started this particular thread, viz., the emergence of
Przeworsk, and its relation to the "genesis" of
Germanic, as Torsten understands this phenomenon.

With respect to the Veneti/Venedi:

If we identify the Pomeranian culture as being Late
Venetian/Venedian, three things to notice:
(a) The Gubin Yastorf culture is admittedly the result
of a fusion between Yastorf and Pomeranian cultures,
with the former clearly dominating.
(b) Przeworsk is much less indebted to Pomeranian
(except for later assimilated additions), but its
leading Yastorf component is Gubin Yastorf.
(c) Gubin Yastorf is also the leading component in the
creation of the Zarubintsi and Poeneshti-Lukashovka
cultures, and the role of Pomeranian culture here is
somewhere between what it played in (a) and (b).


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