Re: Fw: Re: [tied] hoopoe

Sorry, I accidentally erased your last message, Torsten.

Why not drive? It is a Sunday, is it not?

Seriously, there are certainly related words if not the same words in naval
terminology but so what?

Perhaps ideationally 'stump' derives from 'tuft' and not the other way
around.

Yes, I do have a Proto-Language antecedent in mind but I will not bore the
list with it.

If anyone wants to know it, I will send it to them in a plain brown paper
letter with no return address.


Patrick

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Ryan" <proto-language@...>
To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:07 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [tied] hoopoe


> Maybe they are from the same root; but some high-powered people have
> looked and evidently that not.
>
> I wouldlike them to be.
>
> And, in my opinion, you are right about the initial aspirate; but, for my
> purposes, the *p needs to also be an aspirate: *p(h)
>
> (s)t(h)eup(h)
>
>
> Patrick
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rick McCallister" <gabaroo6958@...>
> To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:00 PM
> Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [tied] hoopoe
>
>
> > I think stump and tuft are from the same root --"sth
> > that sticks up, sth plug-shaped". i suppose "tap, top,
> > stop" are from the same word. Also Spanish tope
> > "traffic bump, dead end", topar(se) "to bump into".
> >
> > --- Patrick Ryan <proto-language@...> wrote:
> >
> > > Torsten,
> > >
> > > just to let you know, I am aware of Pokorny's
> > > *(s)teu-p-, 'stump'. and
> > > perhaps we are dealing with a semantically related
> > > unattested meaning of
> > > 'tuft' for it?
> > >
> > >
> > > Patrick
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Patrick Ryan" <proto-language@...>
> > > To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 3:41 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Re: [tied] hoopoe
> > >
> > >
> > > > Yes, Torsten, thank you.
> > > >
> > > > It may be a better cognate for D(w)b, 'hoopoe',
> > > than *tap-.
> > > >
> > > > I looked but could not find anything like <stuppa>
> > > in Pokorny.
> > > >
> > > > Is it there and I missed it?
> > > >
> > > > With Db (*Dwb), PIE *teup- would work much more
> > > satisfactorily.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Patrick
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "fournet.arnaud" <fournet.arnaud@...>
> > > > To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 3:11 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: Re: [tied] hoopoe
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: tgpedersen
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > =============
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Rick
> > > McCallister <gabaroo6958@...>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Perhaps the words for tuft of hair, pompon and
> > > tutf of
> > > > > > tree --if they are related-- are from the word
> > > for
> > > > > > hoopoe, which definitely has a tuft in the
> > > picture.
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > You noticed it too? Perhaps the *dz could
> > > explain the s-mobile, st-/t-
> > > > > alternation in stuppa/top etc:
> > > > >
> > >
> > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/54315
> > > > >
> > > > > Torsten
> > > > >
> > > > > =============
> > > > >
> > > > > One conspicuous feature of s-mobile,
> > > > > is that it's about the only phoneme that
> > > > > never assimilates :
> > > > > s +k > s-k
> > > > > but
> > > > > s + g > s-k as well
> > > > >
> > > > > My own explanation is this :
> > > > >
> > > > > LAte PIE fused *z and *dz
> > > > > (after Salish split off)
> > > > > or maybe *z and *dz disappeared
> > > > > altogether.
> > > > > But *ts did not fuse with *s
> > > > > immediately.
> > > > > They remained in contrast.
> > > > >
> > > > > *ts could not assimilate into *dz
> > > > > because there was no *dz
> > > > > *ts was *locked-in* as unvoiced.
> > > > > Hence ts-g forced inverted assimilation
> > > > > because *dz-g was impossible
> > > > > (no dz in the system !)
> > > > > Hence ts-k which surfaces as *s-k
> > > > >
> > > > > But this is maybe too early to discuss
> > > > > because you haven't admitted *z and *dz yet.
> > > > >
> > > > > Arnaud
> > > > >
> > > > > ==========
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> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________________________________
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