Re: PIE *a -- a preliminary checklist

I write into the text:

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "fournet.arnaud"
<fournet.arnaud@...> wrote:

>
>
> --- jouppe <jouppe@...> wrote:
>
> > In the oldest borrowings in Pre-Finnic it is more a
> > rule than an
> > exception that the second syllable is more or less
> > dropped as the
> > lexeme is adopted directly as a plain stem.
> ========
> What does pre-Finnic mean for you ?
> Arnaud
> ===============

I use 'Pre-Finnic' on my site because all reconstruction levels
between Proto-Uralic and Late Proto-Finnic (='Proto-Baltic-Finnic')
are controversial. The earliest intermediate 'Pre-Finnic'
reconstruction level would be (*)*Proto-Finno-Ugric. The youngest
level would be (*)*Proto-Finno-Saami. For instance here
http://www.helsinki.fi/~tasalmin/kuzn.html you will find the harshest
critisism against these concepts. And as I say, I avoid using them,
sometimes I refer to western Finno-Permic, meaning all combinations
of Finno-Saami-Mordva.

Jouppe

>
> > Parallels would include
> > onki, pursi, susi, vuori, vuosi and others.
> >
> > I have written about this at
> > http://koti.welho.com/jschalin/substitutions.htm
> >
> > substitution of PIE -zg- by Pre-Finnic -sk- is
> > parallelled by the PU
> > word *mos´ki- <= PIE *mozg-.
> ===============
> This PIE root is dubious in the first place.

I am dependent on others on this one:
Lithuanian mazgóti, mazgóju 'wash' < mozg-eh2-ye/o-
OInd. majjáyati 'submerge in water' < mozg-eye/o-
But I must add that this etymology is often cited.

Jouppe

> And you are mixing up
> Finnish loanwords from Baltic
> older loanwords from Indo-Iranian

Borrowing into the form of plain stem has been going on throughout
the Pre-Finnic period, the more the earlier. In this case some
examples are pre-germanic, others pre-aryan. That is not the point
here. The receiving language has this feature.

Jouppe

>
> Arnaud
> ===================
> >
> > The substitution by Pre-Finnic /sh/ (I use the
> > digraph here) is very
> > common in later, Proto-Baltic and Proto-German
> > loans.
> >
> > The word kaski also has no real competing etymology.
> >
> =========
>
> I found that "to burn" can be translated as käräyttää
> possibly *kat?-i
> Hence
> we have a root within Finnish to account for
> kaski < *kat?-k

I have difficulties following this one: käräyttää would presuppose a
stem kärä-. *käträ- would have produced modern Finnish käyrä- These
sequences are well off the mark. And -k- is no suffix in Finnish.

By the way Finnic does not have 'roots', only stems.

Jouppe

>
> Arnaud
> ================
>