--- In
cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@...> wrote:
>
> On 2007-05-13 22:29, alexandru_mg3 wrote:
>
> > Sorry, Piotr, but I cannot detect based on what you applied 2
different
> > criteria:
> >
> > 1)
> > wlkWos is almost in all PIE dialects
> > wlpos is only in some...
> > the majority has kW, the minority has p
>
> First, *wl.kWos has byforms with *p only in dialects that otherwise
show
> some *kW ~ *p variation.
What *kW ~ *p variation has Latin? ONLY *kW everywhere...but the form
of 'wolf' is lupus
> Secondly, *wl.kWos maches *wl.pos somewhat
> better than *(H)akWah2 -- or perhaps *(H)ak(^)wah2 (the
reconstruction
> is a bit uncertain) -- matches *h2op-/*h2ap- (a root noun in IIr.
and in
> the Hoffmann compound *h2ap-h3on-).
..and in Baltic etc..
I don't see why? Why *h2akW-/h2ap- is not similar with *wlkWos/*wlpos?
>Thirdly, even in Gmc. we have a
> reflex of fem. *wl.kW-íh2- > *wulGi- > ON ylgr, demonstrating that
the
> shift of *kW > *p (or even *xW > *f) is relatively recent.
>
> Piotr
>
You are right ON ylgr shows kW, but this doesn't show at all a recent
transformation : it shows only the same dialectal variance kept from
PIE times /kW versus p/ inside different dialects of the same
language.
Why? because :
I. Pre-Germanic '5' was *pempe > Proto-Germanic *fimfi > Gothic
fimf
Pre-Germanic '4' was *petwores > Proto-Germanic *fithwor > Gothic
fidwor
So:
Pre-Germanic *pempe
p-Celtic was *pempe
p-Italic was *pVmpe probably *pempe too
and you are talking about a recent transformations *kW>*p or even
*xW>*f for Germanic?
similarly : we have the same common forms for '4' *petwor(es)
II. Next because *wlpos is attested in Latin (lupus) too: wulfaz and
lupus fitting perfectly => you cannot treat this as a pure
coincidence : same evolution in two different PIE languages
As result: the variants *penpe, *petwores, *wlpos didn't belong to
the inner evolution of one PIE-language or of one of the dialects
inside one PIE language: they all belong to Dialectal-PIE-times
And if so, akWa/apa belong there too
Marius