> > You haven't provided anything that would support the claim that
> > the PIE Urheimat was in Anatolia.
>
> Here is another article that very clearly says
>
> " Language-tree divergence times support the Anatolian theory of
> Indo-European origin"
>
> http://language.psy.auckland.ac.nz/publications/index.php?
> pub=Gray_and_Atkinson2003Nature
>
> Gray and colleagues have shown using phylogenetic techniques used in
> natural sciences that PIE family (assuming it existed) is 3000 years
> older than required by the Kurgan theory. The older date conforms
> to Renfrew's farming hypothesis. Gray is not an archaeologist.
>
As you might have noted, it conforms to the *dates* of Renfrew's
farming hypothesis. But that hypothesis might itself be a product of
European Middleeastocentric history-writing. Cf. the quote from
Bellwod's article here:
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/43178
5500 BCE is before Greek split off, 6500 BCE is just after Hittite
split off, according to the Gray et al. article. I should mention that
once one places the development of agriculture outside of Anatolia,
there is no reason to assume any Urheimat there.
Some of these might interest you wrt to the course of agriculture.
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/42758
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/42285
You might want to search for 'millet' in the cybalist archives for
yourself. Check also
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/42285
According to Ernout-Meillet, there are three roots in IE for millet,
with e-grade in Greek melí:ne:, o-grade in Lith malnos "type of
millet", zero grade in Latin milium, cf Sagart on Chinese in
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/43423
shu2 ... *(b)mlut > zywit "glutinous millet" :
Proto-Hmong (Wang 1979): *mbl&D "glutinous (rice)"
she2 ... *(b)m-lat > zyet "tongue" :
Proto-Hmong (Wang 1979): *mbleiD "tongue"
shi2 ... *(b)m-lit > zyit "fruit" :
Siamese let, m-let, malet "grain"
Something tells me we shouldn't be looking for the beginnings of
agriculture in Anatolia, but on the Asian steppes. After all, we are
talking about grasses. With that goes Renfrew's Out-of-Anatolia
out-the-window.
> > > What I find the most intriguing is the following. The time
> > > difference between the traditional date of Rig Veda and the
> > > Indological one is exactly the same, 3000 years, as the that
> > > between the Anatolian and the Kurgan theories.
> >
> > Erh, why is that intriguing? Are you proposing that the Rgveda was
> > composed in Anatolia?
> No. The older time line of the Anatolian meshes very well with the
> traditional date of the Rig Veda. The geography of the Rig Veda
> clearly places it in the Sindhu-Sarasvati valleys.
But with the age for the Rgveda you propose and the age for PIE you
propose the Rgveda must have been composed at the PIE Urheimat, which
you claim is Anatolia. Or else the Rgveda was translated into Sanskrit
from some unknown extinct(?) Indian language.
Torsten