Re: [tied] Re: A Swedish battle

Thank you, and thank you staying with english. Swedish and other nordic
tongues can be tiresome for those who don´t speak it. Am I right in
assuming that Gestilren could also be a name for the war? If so, we
could be heading for a new discussion at the history forum.

Carl Hult


onsdagen den 28 september 2005 kl 11.16 skrev squilluncus:

> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Carl Hult <datalampa@...> wrote:
> > This is what it says in the danish annals for the years 916-1263:
> >
> > 1210. Bellum Gestilren 15. Kal. August, ubi
> > occubuerunt Suercherus rex et Fulco dux.
> >
> > It looks as if I was wrong. I can´t see any preposition at all but
> I´m
> > not a "latin lover", I specialize in celtic.
>
> No problem. The placename is, as often, undeclined in the Latin
> text.
> It can be locative here, meaning "in".
> Another possibility is simple apposition: "the Gestilren war"
> (whatever Gestilren means?).
>
> On the Eniro map I found Gästre in Uppland, but the other place
> wasn't to find.
> Is it in the neighbourhood between Kungslena and Dalum?
> As a Scanian I am neutral in the contest between Vestgothians and
> Svear but to me it seems more natural to have Sverker-supporting
> Danes in Vestgothia than in Uppland. It is simply to debark at the
> estuary of Ätran and then follow the river up into the heart of
> Falbygden. I have read my Guillou!
>
> Finding an etymology of Gestilren in a Latinized (con)text may be
> difficult. But a metathesis of Gestrilen is quite plausible.
>
> And to support the Svear I found this in Hellquist:
>
> Gästrikland, fsv. Gestrikaland(ia) 1253,
> sammansatt med gen. plur. av
> folknamnet *gcestrikar (jfr y. fsv. tillnamnet
> gestrekie), sannol. bildat av y. fsv.
> by-namnet Gestereke, nu G as tre i Simtuna
> hd Uppl., från vilket håll den fasta
> bebyggelsen av landskapets inre delar synes
> ha utgått. Senare leden: 'ekskog o. d.'
> hör till ek, o. den förra är möjl. besl.
> med Ity. geest f., hög o. torr (sand)-
> terräng över sankare mark. Nordlander
> Hist. tidskr. 1913, s. 212 f., Lindroth
> NoB 1: 138. - Nsv. gästrike kan vara
> den gamla folkslagsbeteckningen, men
> också bero på yngre ellips från
> landskapsnamnet. - G as t ring är väl en
> analogibildning efter hälsing; den
> föreligger i gen. plur. i Gestringaland O.
> Petri Kr.
>
> Yeah. He gives Gästrikland to originate from Gästre!
>
> In manuscripts k and l are written very similarly and copyists often
> confuse them. Perhaps it is in the neighbourhood of Gästrikland this
> battle took place after all?
>
> Who knows? I live in Scania and am neutral.
>
> Lars
>
>
> Lars
>
>
>
>
>

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