Re: [tied] Re: *ap-/*up-/*ip- , rivers in -r

>
>
> >
> > After all, how would one get away with claiming the adverb
> > (preverb/pre/postposition) *ab is IE? It's got an /a/, it's got
> > a /b/, it's got nothing else, and once you said /a/, and you
> > said /b/, you'll have to say 'non-IE'
> >
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> >
> > PCR:
> >
> > It is implied that */a/ and */b/ suggest non-IE origin.
> >
> > This is simply not true.
> >
> > Standard IE reconstruction acknowledges IE */a/ as a result of
>earlier *H2V or *-VH2.
> >
> > IE */b/, though rare, is present in many other almost certainly
>IE words (e.g. *bak-, 'staff'; *bu-, 'lip')
>I'm almost positive *bak- is variant of *pak-, *pag- which means
>approximately the same, and that they're are both loans. And BTW
>Proto-Austronesian is full of words in *pa- with related meanings.
>http://www.angelfire.com/rant/tgpedersen/HbHpg.html
>At least Latin 'bucca' "mouth" looks very un-Latin, with a /b/ and a
>geminate.
>
> >
> > *ab- (*H2Vb-) would also conform to the canonical IE root
>pattern: *CVC.
>
>Problem is Hittite has 'appo' "away" without any laryngeal.
>Kuryl/owicz posited one that disappeared without a trace, which you
>would have to do to. To me, it suggests that 'appo' was loaned at
>some time after the laryngeal disappeared it must have had once
>judging from the Semitic forms.
>http://www.angelfire.com/rant/tgpedersen/Op.html
>

Relying on Hittite for this is not a good idea, since Hittite shows both a
lack of laryngeal where we know there was one, and a laryngeal where we know
there wasn't one. Positing *h3op-h3e is not all that far fetched.,
especially if *h3o -> o- turns out to be write.