Re: IJzelman-?

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, g <st-george@...> wrote:

> > Bearing in mind Venneman's attempt to relate Germanic *i:s-

"ice"

> > with a proposed Basque stem iz- "water" (izurde "water-pig"
> > ie. "dolphin" etc) and his finding that iz- stem in European place
> > names all over the place (eg. Ismaning in Bavaria, Isala > IJsel

in

>
> Perhaps <Isen> ['i:z&n] too, a tributary to the longer river of

<Inn>

> (circa 50 km East of Ismaning, ie, of Munich).

I believe Vennemann mentions it too.

>
> > Holland) I decide to look it up in Celtic languages.
> > I found in Welsh:
> > Isalmaenaidd "Dutch"
> > Isalmaeneg "Dutch language"
> > Isalmaenwr "Dutchman"
> >
> > Odd.

Oops.

> >
> > Further :
> > is "under-, lower"
> > isel "low, base, depressed"
>
> Can all these (according to Vennemann) be kept apart from toponyms
> based on [i:s] of the Isen > Eisen "iron" kind?
>

Yes, according to Vennemann, but he makes a good case for it;
specifically for the 'Eisvogel' "kingfisher" (I wish he'd left out
his reference to a non-existent Danish **'kongfiskr').


Torsten