Re: IJzelman-?

> Bearing in mind Venneman's attempt to relate Germanic *i:s- "ice"
> with a proposed Basque stem iz- "water" (izurde "water-pig"
> ie. "dolphin" etc) and his finding that iz- stem in European place
> names all over the place (eg. Ismaning in Bavaria, Isala > IJsel in

Perhaps <Isen> ['i:z&n] too, a tributary to the longer river of <Inn>
(circa 50 km East of Ismaning, ie, of Munich).

> Holland) I decide to look it up in Celtic languages.
> I found in Welsh:
> Isalmaenaidd "Dutch"
> Isalmaeneg "Dutch language"
> Isalmaenwr "Dutchman"
>
> Odd.
>
> Further :
> is "under-, lower"
> isel "low, base, depressed"

Can all these (according to Vennemann) be kept apart from toponyms
based on [i:s] of the Isen > Eisen "iron" kind?

> which could make sense, if we assume a loan into both Basque and
> Celtic from language where it meant "shallow, quiet water".

The above mentioned Isen rivulet is quite shallow and quiet.

> But 'maen' is "stone" in Welsh. On the other hand *man- is one of
>
> Torsten

George