Re: [tied] Snorri on "Odin's journey"

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, george knysh <gknysh@...> wrote:

> --- tgpedersen <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
> It seems
> > the
> > > types Almgren
> > > 67 and 68 (with subtypes) are the most, and
> > Kostrewski
> > > type M and N
> > > (with subtypes) the least connected with
> > inhumation,
> > > so I believe if
> > > any type of fibula is connected with an intrusive
> > > Sarmatian element,
> > > it should be A67/A68.
> > >
> > > GK: Ukrainian archaeologists consider Almgren
> A67/A68
> > to
> > > be "western type" fibulae (cf. e.g. V.D.Baran,
> > ed.,
> > > "The 'pre-statehood' Slavs of southeastern
> > Europe"[in
> > > Russ.],1990, pp. 76-79) and contrast them with
> > fibulae
> > > of local production in Sarmatian,
> > Scytho-Sarmatian,
> > > Zarubinian and other East European cultures.
> >
> >(TP) Do they ascribe these "western type" fibulae to
> any
> > particular
> > ethnos?
>
> *****GK: Not Baran. Just "western type" along with
> something he calls the "Nertomarus" type fibula. He is
> citing a 1935 Polish-language study of Smizsko.
> Perhaps Almgren himself might be consulted here. I
> don't have a copy: O. Almgren, Studien ueber
> nordeuropaeische fibelformen, Leipzig 1923.*****

I've ordered it from the library. Kortlandt has recently proposed
that Slavic contains loanwords from an otherwise unknown IE language
he calls Temematic, which he proposes Slavic must have met and
overrun.

>
> >
> >
> >
> > (TP)What would you say is characteristic of the
> finds of
> > those Sarmatian
> > groups (particularly of those "Asgard" and Vanaland"
> > areas?).
>
> *****GK: Which of the sites you mention earlier are
> considered Sarmatian? (I had asked you this earlier).

?? I thought that was the question I should ask you?

> Perhaps you could start with a description of their
> inventory, incl. fibulae. And then have a look at the
> work of Russian archaeologists on the gravesites
> between Don and Volga for the period in question. That
> would involve principally "Aorsan" and "Sirakian"
> graves. One item to look for would be
> polychromic-style fibulae, which Bosporan masters
> manufactured for the Sarmatian market. Objects with
> "tamga" markers are also useful indicators.******
> >
> >
> > And have the fibulae type Kostrzewski var M and
> > N been linked
> > with any particular ethnos?
>
> *****GK: I don't know. Baran notes that many fibulae
> of the "Latenized" cultures (this includes Przeworsk
> and Oksywie) are of an "inter-regional"
> character.*****
> >

So that we might wonder if they were carried by "inter-regional"
peoples ;-.

Torsten