Re: Alb. katër

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Brian M. Scott" <BMScott@...>
wrote:

> > Richard Wordingham wrote:
>
> >> For an example of /k/ > /f/, we have PIE *reuk 'pluck' (?
> >> - the German gloss is 'rupfen') (Extension d. of Pokorny
> >> root #1623 *reu 'tear out, acquire,...') > OE _ru:h_ >
> >> English "rough", formerly [rVf] in X-SAMPA, i.e.
> >> homophonous with English "ruff".

<Snip>

> The point is that English
> <rough>, with /f/, is from OE _ru:h_, from Gmc. *ru:hwa-;
> this Gmc. *h is from PIE *k (Watkins gives *ru&-k- as the
> source), so English <rough> is in fact an example of the
> change /k/ > /f/ (by way of /x/).

What's the evidence for the *w in Proto-Germanic? Onions gives the
Proto-Germanic as *ru:x(w)a- (I'm not sure of the final vowel - I'm
quoting from memory), but the only justification I could see for it
is a disbelief in PIE pure 'velar' *k (as opposed to *k^). /kW/ etc.

> /f/ bypassing /p/ is commonplace - a Bangkok dialect of Thai

has /khw-, kw-/ > /f-/, while /ph-, p-/ are unaffected. (I've even
heard a Thai apply this change in English as a register shift to
express extreme annoyance!)

Richard.