Re: [tied] Re: Balkan Serpents (was: alb. gji (breast))

From: alex_lycos
Message: 18791
Date: 2003-02-13

Piotr Gasiorowski wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "alex_lycos" <altamix@...>
> To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [tied] Re: Balkan Serpents (was: alb. gji (breast))
>
>
>> I have to search some more for a root of "vitulus" . There must be
>> something like vit- or vet-, but it seems I
> have to wait until I get my etymologic dictionary of Latin
>
> *wet-elo-s 'yearling (animal a year old)', from PIE *wetos 'year'.
> There are many similar derivatives througout IE. You can check the
> root *wet- in Pokorny
>
> Piotr


Hmm, I don't know.
Varro means that "vitulus" has been called by Old Greek "italus"
Let me see what I could find:
Varro (L.L.)
"Vitulus, quod graece antiquitus 'italous'."
Varro (R.R. II. 5)
"Graecia enim antiqua (ut scribit Timaeus) tauros vocabat 'italous'."
Apollodorus means in (Bibl. II 5. 10) that the people called 'tursenes'
called too the 'taurus' , 'italos'.
Festus ( I have no ref. where to look for):
"Italia dicta, quod magnos italos, hoc est boves habeat." ( I must
recognise I do not understand the sens of the sentence)
It seems the word "vitalus" is the word for "taurus" and it existed in
Latin too. Which should be the connection with latin "vita" and
"vitalis"? For people who know Latin enough, may be interesting the
connection.
Are there any other cognates? I think at the word "batal" in Romanian.
Batal= castrated ram. It is said that this one should have a better
flesh as the non-castrated one. This is not a bull of course, but is in
its way a "bull" too:-)
The etym. for the Romanian word is given from Turkish "battal". Turkish
"battal"=villain.
BTW english "bull":
bull (1) - O.E. bula "a steer," from P.Gmc. *bulon. Extended after 1615
to males of other large animals (elephant, alligator, whale, etc.). An
uncastrated male, reared for breeding, as opposed to a bullock or steer.

Heeeeehehhehe , I can just laugh. There is too this "uncastrated male "?
And it does not come from turkish "battal"? What a wonder:-)

Forgetting the joke, which is the PIE root for PGmc *bulon? Of course
the good, old *bhel- which gave in Latin what? "filix, folis,
follio,flacus, flagitare.
It seems Latin "vitulus" & Co are not Latin words but borowed from
somwhere else.From Germanic? They have an "bu, ba, bl, by" from PIE *bh;
from Celtic? They have too an "b" from PIe *bh. From thracians? We don't
know.

Question: at least the etymology of "italia" is cleared? Which is this
one then?

Alex