Re: [tied] Hornbeam

From: Piotr Gasiorowski
Message: 9976
Date: 2001-10-03

The EIEC reconstructs *(s)greh2b(H)-, based on Umbrian Grabovius 'oak god', Old Prussian wosi-grabis 'spindle-tree (_Euonymus_)', Lith. skroblas 'hornbeam', Slavic *grabU 'hornbeam', NGk. grabouna 'hornbeam, oak' (borrowed?), plus a few really eccentric forms like Latvian ska:barde, Albanian shkozë, Latin carpinus 'hornbeam'.
 
*g- ~ *sk- is an uncontroversial alternation (cf. Slavic drozdU : Baltic strazdas 'thrush'), but I don't see why a laryngeal is needed: if the root-final stop is (dialectal IE) *b, Winterian lengthening accounts for the long vocalism in Balto-Slavic and the protoform may be *(s)grob- or *(s)grab-. The Umbrian name may be a loan from Illyrian (*o > a at least in Messapic). Of course we are left with the embarrassing combination of *g and *b in the same root (*b being at the same time a rare phoneme), but if it's a relatively late regional term, strictly PIE constraints may not apply to it, and at any rate *grob-/*skrob- looks pronounceable, as opposed to *sgrah2bH-.
 
Piotr
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Miguel Carrasquer Vidal
To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2001 1:11 AM
Subject: Re: [tied] IE roots

On Tue, 2 Oct 2001 11:16:12 -0300, "João S. Lopes Filho"
<jodan99@...> wrote:

>1- Is there a phonetic  law S+g- > C- ?

There is Sieb's law, roughly *k- / *-g ~ *sk-, vs. *gh- ~ *sk(h)-
(i.e. s-mobile prefixed to words beginning with voiced aspirates gives
s + voiceless aspirate in Sanskrit, and occasionally in Greek or
Slavic [assuming skh- > x-]).  However, Sieb's law is controversial.