Peter T. Daniels skribis:

>
> Ph. D. wrote:
> >
> > Peter T. Daniels skribis:
> > >
> > > Do you have a display of them? It sounds like a somewhat
> > > unCherokee notion. Or did you use Sequoyah's handwritten
> > > forms? I remember Zapf's as Optima-like, with very subtle
> > > shadings, but the one place I've seen them was in a very
> > > expensive book (and it didn't include the entire syllabary).
> >
> > Actually Zapf's forms have fairly long serifs, so maybe not
> > so much like Optima. You probably saw them in the book
> > _Hermann_Zapf_and_his_Design_Philosophy_ published
> > in 1987 by the Society of Typographic Arts in Chicago (on
> > page 201). I paid fifty dollars for my copy when it was first
> > published which didn't seem too expensive to me.
>
> How many books sold for $50 in 1987? That's like saying
> $50,000 was not an excessive price for a Mercedes-Benz.

Well, "very expensive" is in the eye of the beholder, but fifty
dollars then would be about eight dollars today for a book with
a page size of 30x20 cm, 250 pages, and one hundred full color
plates. On the other hand, _The_World's_Writing_Systems_
was priced by the publisher in 1996 at $125 which would be
$144 today for a book with a page size of 23x16 cm, 900 pages,
and no color illustrations. I suppose it's apples and oranges,
but would you describe WWS as "very expensive" or even
"excessive"?

> The "serifs" are integral, distinctive parts of the characters, so they
> have to be there (and thus shouldn't be considered serifs).

For some characters, they are integral parts. For others, they are not.
I have uploaded a scan from Zapf's book here:
http://www.marlboromats.com/Cherokee.jpg

> > I believe the man who commisioned this font was Walter
> > Hamady, a private press operator in Wisconsin.
>
> So why did he never use it for anything, or allow anyone else to
> use it?

I wrote to Hamady a month ago, but I have received no reply. I wrote
to Paul Duensing, who used to operate a private typefoundry. He is
good friends with Hermann Zapf and cut the matrices for Zapf's
last metal typeface (Zapf Civilité). His reply:

) The history of the Cherokee font is pretty much as follows.
) Hamady submits an application for funding to commission a
) special font for printing a number of legends in that language in
) a bi-lingual edition. Prof. Zapf agreed to design the font (based
) on Walbaum). In due course the drawings were received, I made
) patterns, cut a few matrices and made casts, proofs of which I
) shipped to Walter and Hermann. Then the project sort of came
) apart and nothing further was done with it. In the past six or ten
) years, various requests were received (mostly from graduate
) students in typography whose instructors needed a diploma
) project). I contacted Hermann who said in effect "I have no further
) traffic with the Sequoia project." then contacted Walter who said
) "did they pay for it?" So the project ground to a halt.
) That's about it. Zapf won't move on it without Hamady's
) permission, and Walter doesn't want to give away what he sees
) as his property.

Zapf is 86 years old. Hamady is probably about the same. Perhaps
their heirs will agree to do something with it. It's the best looking
Cherokee font I've seen.

--Ph. D.