Re: Numbering schemes adopted for Vinaya Piṭaka

From: petra kieffer-pülz
Message: 4847
Date: 2016-12-10

Dear Balaji,

regarding the Vinaya there exist two type of references, either to  Volume and page (which always refers to the PTS edition, also to be found in GRETIL now) or to books (Mv = Mahāvagga, Cv = Cullavagga, P = Parivāra), and chapters (first number) and sub chapters (second, and third numbers).  A Mv I 197 does not exist. Either you have Mv I plus a number up to 79 or you have Vin + I for the volume in which you find the Mahāvagga, and a number referring to the page. I guess you got the reference from DPPN. There it is clearly Vin I 194ff. And there you will find the story of Soṇa. If you want the other type of reference, it is in Mv V  13.  

Best,
Petra


Am 10.12.2016 um 18:36 schrieb Balaji balaji.ramasubramanian@... [palistudy]:

 

Dear friends,

I wanted to find the Pāḷi original of Mv.I.197 - a reference I got from Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi in this forum a few months back regarding the story where Ven. Soṇa is urged by the Buddha to chant the Aṭṭhakavagga and is then praised for his excellent chanting. I appreciate this help very much. I wanted to read it in Pāḷi from the Tipiṭaka itself.

Now, I find the Chaṭṭha Saṅghāyana - CSCD (www.tipitaka.org) and Adroid Tipiṭaka (Digital Pāḷi Reader) to be very helpful free resources in getting the Pāḷi originals in various scripts. I can read in the Devanāgarī, Roman, and with some effort even in the Thai script, although mostly I prefer the Devanāgarī. I have found every Sutta in the Sutta Piṭaka very easily so far. For example, if the reference says AN 4.56, I know that I need to look up the Anguttara Nikāya, check the book of fours catukkanipātapāḷi, and look at the fifth chapter titled rohitassavaggo and find the Sutta there. Again, if someone says MN 61, I can easily go to Majjhima Nikāya, and since I know it is divided into three books of 50 suttas each, I check the second book majjhimapaṇṇāsapāḷi, and since each chapter has ten Suttas each, I look up the second chapter bhikkhuvaggo, and find the Sutta there.

But I am a little puzzled by the numbering scheme adopted for the Vinaya Piṭaka. I have been a total failure at tracing down Mv.I.197. I see that the Mahāvagga has several khandhakas, of which the first one is mahākhandhaka. Does the I.197 refer to 197th paragraph in the mahākhandhaka or the 197th section, or what? No matter which way I try to interpret the reference, I am unable to find it. If I assume it is the 197th numbered paragraph, I find that the mahākhandhaka has only 131 numbered paragraphs. If I assume that it is the 197th section, then there are only 67 sections in the mahākhandhaka. If I assume that the in the referencing scheme 'Mv.I.197', the Roman numeral I has no meaning, and look for the 197th section in the Mahāvagga counting all the sections in each chapter, then also I find that I end up with karaṇīyadoḷasaka in the kathinakkhandhaka which if anyone reads, will know immediately that it has nothing to do with the story of Ven. Soṇa's chanting.

So I am completely puzzled by this numbering scheme. So I wanted to find out what was up. My plan was to visit Abhayagiri Buddhist monastery and request the monks there to help me find the reference. But for about a month I couldn't make a visit - maybe I will go there in 2017. Meanwhile, since I got this reference from Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi, I visited a local Sri Lankan Buddhist temple in the south Bay area where I live, and asked them for help. And the Sinhalese Tipiṭaka edition they have has the same numbering schematization in CSCD - I haven't checked completely, but at least the mahākhandhaka seems to be the same.

It appears that in the west scholars use a completely different numbering scheme, and I have no clue where their numbering actually comes from. Are the references coming from the PTS? And if so, how come the PTS numbering scheme is so completely out of whack with the Sinhalese and Burmese editions? I will go to Abhayagiri and Metta Forest monasteries to see if the schematization in the Royal Thai edition is also the same as the CSCD, but I suspect it would be roughly the same.

I would also appreciate if someone can help me understand the history behind the numbering schemes used. Where do they come from, are they different for the different editions, and if so why? Why did PTS adopt a completely different numbering scheme and not simply go with a more traditional schema where we number Suttas as MN II.2.1 instead of MN 61?

Thanks,
Balaji



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