Re: Meaning of "Buddha"?

Dear Ven. Nyanatusita,

> But how could he recollect /vimutti? /Only the arahant and the Buddha
> have this experience, while 'recollect' means to bring up a memory.
I take recollecting  in a meditative context to involve a measure of
reexperiencing.
> Gotama could not have recollected /vimutti/ until he became Buddha. In
> the prose it is used together with /paṭividdha/, and in the verse with
> /abhiññāya /which  suggests that it is more than  just recollection.
Yes and more than just understanding.
>
> Perhaps we interpret the verse, and also the prose, differently? As I
> understand the verse, it refers to Gotama's /sambodhi /under the Bodhi
> tree. Gotama became Buddha through wisely understanding/becoming
> enlightened with regards (/anubuddha/) the four dhammas.
>
> How do you interpret it?
>
In fact, I was looking only at the verse. If you take it with the prose,
then it must be close in meaning to paṭividdho which certainly involves
some kind of experiencing, not just knowledge about.
>> I think this indicates the range of meanings it can have. In
>> interpreting the Canonical texts, especially those in verse, it is
>> important to draw upon the usage of all the older Indic languages
>> i.e. Sanskrit and Prakrit both. Otherwise one narrows the meaning to
>> one dependent upon the much later commentaries and specific to
>> Buddhist contexts. The commentaries are invaluable, but they are not
>> always aware of older and wider usages. This is especially true of
>> verse which tends in Pali as in other languages to utilize unusual
>> forms and meanings.
>
> Yes, but I am sometimes wondering how reliable Monier Williams is
> since  it was made in 1872 and because he does not give references.
>
Monier-Williams is certainly variable. Often references are available in
the German dictionary of Böhtlingk & Roth, but not always. Still he is a
useful starting point. If I were writing an article, I would try to look
at a range of passages directly rather than use a dictionary. But there
is not time for that in a listgroup discussion.
> The next stanza has abhiññāya which Bhikkhu Bodhi renders as 'Having
> directly known'. This too, I think, means that it is not just a matter
> of 'having information about'.
>
> I agree with this, but I think that Bhikkhu Bodhi means
> `understanding' in the sense of understanding with wisdom.
>
Probably what underlies this is the issue of what exactly is meant by
wisdom. With appropriate preparation I can explain the four noble truths
to an Oxford class in great detail and precision. On an off day that may
involve very little wisdom and perhaps leave me only a little more
alert. If I talk about them in a meditative context, there may be less
precision but afterwards I will feel transformed and changed because
wisdom is present. In other words it is not just about the ability to
manipulate information and comprehend concepts.

Lance Cousins