Re: Mmd- (ka) part 1 (aniiya/iiya)

Hi Jim,

Thanks for the comments, and for the references to other relevant passages.

>
>This rule is too general, like for impersonal and passive verbs.

This makes sense. The rule I quoted was only about how to formally
derive an fpp, rather than giving information about what the
resulting forms mean or how they can be used.

I have a tendency to blur the distinction -- one of my weak points
which I'm trying to get over.

>  The
>rule needed here instead is like the ones for the special uses of the
>tenses. For the kicca suffixes (tabba, aniiya, ya, and other forms) we
>need to turn to the rules about the various uses found at Sd 1244-5 on
>p.862. These uses are: pesa (direction), atisagga (permission),
>pattakaala (proper time), avassaka (necessity), and adhami.na
>(indebtedness?). Note that I'm just repeating Vasu's renderings of the
>equivalent terms in Panini (near the end of Bk 3, Ch 3). The problem
>here is that there isn't any for 'araha' (worthy, deserving) even
>though the following rule 1246 for the infinitive does include it.

This might not be so odd after all. The list you provide
(pesa...adhami.na) are more along the lines of pragmatic situations
where fpp's might be used. Whereas the rule about "in the meaning
'araha'" seems more properly semantic.  (there are similar lists of
pragmatic uses of verb forms like the optative and imperative at Sd
880-882). The former sorts of lists really seem to go beyond the
linguistic 'meanings' of the forms and instead get into the types of
real-life contexts where the forms are appropriate.

>The Sadd exclusion of the meaning of capability is also problematic
>because I think that one is needed too for those -able words like
>peyya (drinkable). I have no idea why Kaccaayana or Aggava.msa would
>leave out or overlook such rules.

Interesting question. I'm including it in my growing list of such questions.

One thing I'm interested in are distinctions like between da.t.thabba
and dassaniiya. As you know, the former usually means (esp in the
Sadd itself) 'to be viewed/regarded as' while the latter means
'beautiful', as in deserving to be looked at. Or vattabba (to be
said) and vacaniiya (to be spoken to). Perhaps Aggava.msa's
explanation of dassaniiya as an abstract noun in -ana plus a suffix
-iiya provides a clue about the historical origin of the -aniiya fpp
suffix? and maybe it really could help us understand the origin of
some of the differences of meaning associated with the different ways
of forming what have all been grouped together as fpp's? As you said,
we probably need to collect many more examples before being able to
say (if ever).


best regards,

/Rett