Dear Jim,

Thanks very much for your suggestion. I think having braahma.nakule modify ugghatavohaaravasena makes much more sense than the way I had it.

Can aparikpakka mean "opposite"?  Dictionary definition is usually "undeveloped" or "immature".

Thanks very much for your help,

Best wishes,

Bryan

--- On Sat, 2/19/11, Jim Anderson <jimanderson.on@...> wrote:

From: Jim Anderson <jimanderson.on@...>
Subject: Re: [Pali] Question on commentary to Gha.tiikaara sutta (MN 81)
To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
Received: Saturday, February 19, 2011, 4:02 PM
















 









Hi Bryan,



You wrote:

<< The commentary states



mu.n.dakena sama.nakenaa ti mu.n.da.m mu.n.doti, sama.na.m vaa sama.noti

vattu.m va.t.tati, aya.m pana aparipakka~naa.nattaa braahma.nakule

uggahitavohaaravaseneva hii.lento evamaaha. (3.280)



which I tentatively translate as



mu.n.dakena sama.makena: It is proper to call a shaved person a "mu.n.do" or

an ascetic a "sama.no" - because of using these terms, this person [i. e.

Jotipaal] spoke thus, looking down upon [those] whose knowledge is not

developed in respect of a brahmanic family.



I find the commentary a bit confusing and the grammar awkward (unless of

course I am misreading it which is very possible) but it appears that the

commentator is explaining why Jotipaal (who is a brahmin) is calling the

Buddha Kassapa these names (mu.n.da and sama.na).



Is the form aparipakka~naa.nattaa in the ablative?

(Skt.aparipakvaj~naanatvaat?). >>



Yes.



<< Is braahma.nakule in the locative or could this be acccus. plural (object

of hii.lento)? >>



Locative singular.



This is how I would translate: "aya.m pana aparipakka~naa.nattaa

braahma.nakule uggahitavohaaravaseneva hii.lento evamaaha."



But he (Jotipaala), from there being an opposite understanding through the

influsence of terms acquired in a Brahmin family, looking down, spoke thus.



By using the diminutive suffix 'ka' after mu.n.da and sama.na he is showing

disrespect.



Best wishes,



Jim





























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